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Can Congress pass a national abortion bill? — 26 Comments

  1. It is always instructive to compare the laws in this country with those elsewhere. In France, for example. abortion is allowed until 14 weeks and afterwards severely restricted. In fact, our laws surrounding this contentious issue are amongst the most permissive in the entire world. Feminists (and leftists in general) ought not to have abandoned the mantra of the Clinton years (“safe, legal, and rare”) and become so extreme and so radical as to engender the inevitable reaction to their lunacy.

  2. I think you state it well, neo.

    No, Constitutionally the Legislative branch should be unable ,to pass a law restricting states from restricting abortion, but the Legislative, Judicial and Executive branches have a long history of ignoring the Constitution, so anything is possible. The Legislative’s twists and tricks to pass the ACA and the Roberts’ court’s rhetorical gymnastics to support it are one of the more egregious, recent examples.

  3. Just posted at Quillette: A long article comparing pre-Roe and post-Roe abortion novels: while the author’s summaries of a surprisingly long list of novels (including one by Joan Didion) are interesting, his conclusion is typical of the Left: ” . . . if the leaked draft opinion written by Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito becomes law, conservative states like Mississippi won’t have to worry about terrorists shooting up abortion clinics, because there probably won’t be any clinics left to shoot up. Instead, we are likely to see a return of the kind of abortion novel that proliferated in the late-’60s—stories filled with characters who are forced by carelessness and circumstance to make the kind of agonizing personal choices that adults who grew up in a post-Roe America were fortunate enough not to have to confront.”

    https://quillette.com/2022/05/05/get-ready-for-the-return-of-the-abortion-novel/

  4. Looks like the WHPA of 2021 has aims somewhat beyond the mere nationalization of abortion services access. See the below for starters:

    Sec. 2, (4) Reproductive justice requires every individual to have the right to make their own decisions about having children regardless of their circumstances and without interference and discrimination. Reproductive Justice is a human right that can and will be achieved when all people, regardless of actual or perceived race, color, national origin, immigration status, sex (including gender identity, sex stereotyping, or sexual orientation), age, or disability status have the economic, social, and political power and resources to define and make decisions about their bodies, health, sexuality, families, and communities in all areas of their lives, with dignity and self-determination.

    (5) Reproductive justice seeks to address restrictions on reproductive health, including abortion, that perpetuate systems of oppression, lack of bodily autonomy, white supremacy, and anti-Black racism. This violent legacy has manifested in policies including enslavement, rape, and experimentation on Black women; forced sterilizations; medical experimentation on low-income women’s reproductive systems; and the forcible removal of Indigenous children. Access to equitable reproductive health care, including abortion services, has always been deficient in the United States for Black, Indigenous, and other People of Color (BIPOC) and their families.

  5. sdfert:

    Black women have comparatively high abortion rates, so it’s hard to believe they are systematically kept from having abortions.

  6. Quite so, neo. Rep Chu looks down her nose at these poor benighted victims she thinks herself to aid. Their offspring can’t be extinguished quickly enough it seems.

  7. “My body, my choice” seems to have undergone a period of quietude with the mandatory vaccinations. Now we even have a budding Supreme Court justice who cannot define “woman” which now requires a biologist.

  8. Congress can pass that, or any other number of unconstitutional bills. Even a national Defense Of Marriage Act against gay marriage – but it’s the SC which decides if such a law is Constitutional. In the case of DOMA, a law enacted by democratically elected representatives, the Court said “Nope”. But that Court had a Democrat oriented activist majority, as compared to the current limited Federal gov’t conservative Court (thanks Trump, Heritage Foundation, and millions of pro-life Trump supporters).

    I even think there’s a 90% chance some Dem introduce such a National Abortion bill, and about 50% chance it passes. If so, there’s probably some 95% chance this Court will declare such a law unconstitutional.

    Something not too mentioned is that in prior generations, there was a lot more “slut shaming” against unmarried mothers having promiscuous sex. Many, maybe most, pro-life Republicans have long been willing to accept higher welfare for unmarried mothers, and less slut shaming, in order to reduce the number of abortions for economic reasons.

    It’s now about 40% of kids are born to unmarried mothers, including some 75% Black kids and 30% of White kids. Such kids are much more likely to become criminals and to have other problems – but pro-life folk are truly glad they weren’t aborted.

  9. “Making abortion available nationwide, in every single state, would actually take a constitutional amendment, and the same would be true for making it illegal in every state.”

    Why would it necessarily take a constitutional amendment to make abortion illegal in every state? Congress could take the relevant parts of the 14th Amendment literally —

    “nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law…”

    “The Congress shall have the power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.”

    — and enact an appropriate statute. And let the Supreme Court have at it when an appropriate case comes up.

    See https://www.firstthings.Com/article/2021/04/abortion-is-unconstitutional for a fully developed argument along these lines.

  10. I agree with Tom Grey that a pro-abortion bill will be introduced in congress. Odds of passage less than 50% due to filibuster, but let’s suppose it does pass.
    Who would have standing to challenge it in Federal Court? The Product of Conception? A random person who would have a spouse or sibling but for the abortion and now has a claim of loss of consortium? I’m finding it difficult to conjure a “victim” who would be able to claim a loss. It’s not like a law against murder, where the state says “Thou shalt not!” Here, the state is saying only “Thou may if thou so wishes, but only if thou so desires.”
    IANAL. obviously.

  11. Tom Grey (4:34 pm) writes that “in prior generations, there was a lot more ‘slut shaming’ against unmarried mothers having promiscuous sex.”

    I am definitely opposed to “slut shaming”, but I am willing to unequivocally state this:

    Except for instances of rape, forcible incest, or certain unforeseen medical conditions, women already do have a (foreseeable) choice. “My body, my choice” indeed.

    Now, I do not intend for the following to be a religious argument, but I find myself *appalled* at the low regard for the sanctity of human life in our culture [I know, “sanctity” is a religious word, but it’s the most apropos word that I have handy].

    “If it feels good, do it” and all that. You-all know the rest . . .

  12. “The WHPA announces as its purpose “to put an end to harmful restrictions…”

    Exactly of what would “harmful restrictions ” consist?

    The Mass. bill currently under consideration would hold as legal the ‘termination’ of a baby’s life up to 30 days after birth.

    Infanticide returns to the Western Hemisphere…

    Above, Watt quotes from the 14th amendment; “nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law…”

    Indeed, ‘personhood’ pre-birth lies at the heart of abortion.

    Reason declares that its fundamental relevance cannot be dismissed.

  13. I agree with Tom Grey that a pro-abortion bill will be introduced in congress. Odds of passage less than 50% due to filibuster, but let’s suppose it does pass.
    Who would have standing to challenge it in Federal Court?

    There is a black woman who is a survivor of a failed abortion. She is running for Congress as a Republican. Don’t recall which state.

  14. The Mass. bill currently under consideration would hold as legal the ‘termination’ of a baby’s life up to 30 days after birth. — G.B.

    That’s astonishing. It’s under consideration so here’s hoping that sensible people will prevail.

    One of the curiosities, to me anyway, of the old abortion debate was the fact that most everywhere(?) when a pregnant woman was murdered it was chalked up as a double homicide. I was amazed when NY state passed a law not too long ago eliminating that second homicide. It’s only a lump of tissue after all. At least they are now consistent. Not an improvement IMO.

  15. M J R; Tom Grey:

    One of the main ways that previous generations dealt with premarital pregnancy was the institution of the shotgun wedding.

  16. TommyJay:

    In a double homicide, both lives are terminated by an outside perpetrator. There is no “it’s my body” argument available. So although there is some inconsistency it’s not completely inconsistent to allow abortion but to consider the murder of a pregnant woman to be a double homicide.

  17. West TX Intermediate Crude:

    I don’t know who would have standing, but perhaps a state that has passed abortion bans or restrictions.

  18. They weep and wail and gnash their teeth over how far a woman may have to drive to get an abortion, but they don’t give a rat’s a** about an entire village in Alaska: the left continually blocks building a road though a national forest that would link the town to the nearest hospital.

    Because it would “set a dangerous precedent.”

  19. Watt:

    The reason an amendment would be required is that fetuses are not persons under the law in the US. That article you linked argues otherwise, or at least argues that they should be, but they are not at this point and even the historic background for the idea that US law has treated them as such is very shaky. See this:

    Before the founding of the United States, the common law of England permitted abortions before the fetus “quickened,” which was the term used to describe the mother’s first feeling of the fetus moving in her uterus. Typically, quickening occurs between the sixteenth and twentieth weeks of pregnancy.

    In the first chapter of the United States’ history, laws regarding abortions did not exist until the 1800s…In the nineteenth century, abortions were generally unsafe and the women who managed to survive abortions often became sterile. By the 1880s, all states had laws criminalizing abortions, and these laws stayed intact until the 1960s and 1970s.

  20. The Left really is self obsessed, and, perhaps, quite insane.

  21. Meanwhile a British journalist named Simon Gwynn “wants to know if you would murder SCOTUS Justices Samuel Alito and Clarence Thomas if you had the chance.” Gwynn later tweeted that “I’ve removed my recent two tweets about the US Supreme Court as on reflection they’re obviously pretty irresponsible, though I don’t think they would be against Twitter’s TOS. FYI I don’t endorse murdering anyone, but don’t think there’s anything wrong with thought experiments.”

    As is noted over at Legal Insurrection, “Think before you tweet. Also, if you think like this, you need to talk to someone.”

    https://legalinsurrection.com/2022/05/british-gaming-journalist-wants-to-know-if-youd-murder-justices-alito-thomas-if-you-could/

    We all admire Clarence Thomas– but I have to admit Alito has a special place in my personal Hall of Fame– he’s a Phillies fan, and we’re an endangered species, particularly given the Phightins’ wretched performance so far this season. Anyway, here’s “Justice Sam Alito, The Phillies Fan”:

    https://abovethelaw.com/2010/04/justice-sam-alito-the-phillies-fan/

    My current Gedankenexperiment is to imagine Simon Gwynn being sentenced to watch a full three-hours-plus Phillies game seated next to Sam Alito.

  22. Neo:

    I don’t think your quote is dispositive.

    Admittedly, Roe holds that a fetus is not a person under the 14th Amendment.

    I guess I’m getting at something more procedural. As occurred in the scenario underlying Dobbs, a state legislature essentially stuck its finger in the eye of the United States Supreme Court and enacted a statute that violates Roe. That forced the issue, giving us the Dobbs case.

    At the federal level, does the fact that the Supreme Court has ruled a certain way prohibit Congress a priori from enacting a statute that violates that ruling? I mean, Congress “accidentally” does that from time to time; someone sues; and a case eventually comes up to the Supreme Court, which rules that the statute violates Equal Protection or whatever. Often, the Court comes up with a new or extended interpretation of a constitutional provision and quashes the statute. But — and I can’t think of examples offhand but I’m pretty sure it’s happened — sometimes the Court will rule against the statute based on its existing precedent. In which case, presumably Congress should have known better or gone through the amendment process.

    So, in the present situation, could Congress accidentally-on-purpose enact a statute along the lines I mentioned in my earlier comment, which would no doubt give rise to a lawsuit (no doubt with an injunction/stay subproceeding), which would no doubt make it to the Supreme Court — thus “circumventing” the amendment process? I’m not sure about this — but why not? (See previous paragraph.) And would the Supreme Court necessarily have to rule on the basis of the Roe precedent, or could it take the opportunity to reverse itself (as will apparently happen in Dobbs, as triggered by the state statute)? Again, why in the present situation would be the amendment process be the only remedy?

    PS: The “Preview” button doesn’t appear to work.

  23. “The Left really is self obsessed, and, perhaps, quite insane.” SCOTTtheBADGER

    It’s not that they don’t distinguish between right and wrong, it’s that they think that wrong is right and right, wrong.

    Which is the inevitable result of embracing ideologies that rest upon the rejection of basic attributes of human nature. Ideologies which also reject basic principles that govern the external reality within which we all exist.

    It’s not accidental that the more divorced someone’s life is from basic realities, the more easily it is to imagine that reality is whatever it is wished to be.

    Which explains the rural vs city split, i.e. meat doesn’t come from the grocery store as city dwellers pretend to themselves, it comes from yummy animals we slaughter.

    Every time I drive to the grocery store, I pass by fields with cattle grazing, fattening themselves up for the butcher.

    Add in the rejection of the premise that there is a merciful but just creator, who will hold us accountable for our actions in life and you end up with what has become known as Dostoevsky’s dictum; “If God does not exist, then everything is permitted.”

    Everything because absent God, only personal opinion remains and who am I to tell you what you can and cannot do?

    Leaving might makes right to settle any differences.

    Call them ‘unsane’.

  24. The digusting Minneapolis Star Tribune reached a new low, entitling an editorial

    “Pregnant people have rights.
    Products of conception don’t.”

  25. Speaking of hate speech that ought to be suppressed but won’t.
    https://notthebee.com/article/important-reminder-after-leak-of-supreme-court-decision-that-chuck-schumer-literally-threatened-supreme-court-justices-if-they-overturned-roe

    On the other hand, if all the hateful statements by Democrats were suppressed, the news would be very short.
    And we might not be aware of just how bad they have gotten.
    Or perhaps many of them always thought this way, but were canny enough not to say the quiet parts out loud.

  26. Doc Zero’s essay on the leak.
    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1521824195495309314.html

    It’s not a “SCOTUS leak,” the work of a lone rogue staffer. It’s a coordinated hard-Left/Democrat Party operation, and it’s going to backfire on them, because the Dem Party has utterly lost touch with ordinary Americans. It has no idea how they think or what concerns them.

    For starters, the public simply does not agree with the extremist Democrat position on abortion. The Left has bullied and terrorized the public into passively ACCEPTING Roe v Wade for generations, but they don’t SUPPORT it. Bubbled Dems don’t understand the difference.
    There’s nothing about the post-Roe landscape that the majority of Americans finds particularly troubling. The Left’s screaming freakout will alienate far more voters than it persuades. Dems needed to keep their kooks hidden, but instead they’re putting on a circus. Big mistake.

    The thuggery on display from Democrats right now is DEEPLY alienating to most Americans. They don’t want to see imperious Dems shrieking about packing the Court and shredding the Constitution, or thugs menacing the families of Supreme Court justices.
    Working Americans are hurting under Joe Biden’s policies. The last thing they want to see is a three-ring D.C. circus over protecting the income streams of rich, influential abortionists, hard on the heels of Biden trying to pick their pockets for student loan “forgiveness.”

    The demographics Democrats were already losing to Republicans in this seismic political realignment are decidedly not pro-abortion. Dem extremism, coupled with Dem callousness toward their real concerns, will push them further away.
    The Dems might rack up a few more points with a group they already had locked down tight, suburban single women, although a lot of that political support is pooled in blue areas that will make sure nothing actually changes after Roe is struck down.

    Sure, pro-abortion activists and Very Online virtue-signalers will be energized… but so will pro-lifers, and last night’s primary turnout suggests GOP voters are far more energized than Democrats. Biden’s malaise will soak up much of the jolt Dems are trying to give their base.
    The thing about energizing the respective activist communities is that pro-lifers view the end of Roe as the beginning, not the end, of their activism. They know they will have a lot of work to do, in state after state, and it’s a crusade they’ve been anticipating for decades.

    Their morale is high because pro-lifers have been astoundingly successful so far, even with Roe in place, even with the left-wing media relentlessly demonizing them. They held their ground on one of the most slanted playing fields ever. They’d love to play on a level one.
    We’re also in the middle of a broad and deep voter uprising against authoritarianism, and Roe is profoundly authoritarian in character. The people are sick and tired of “experts” with horrible track records insisting they’re not allowed to vote on anything important.

    I’m not guaranteeing the GOP will play their cards right – but if they do, there is a powerful political narrative to be written, looping Roe in with the anti-groomer and anti-CRT battles, left-wing corporate totalitarianism, pandemic tyranny – the arrogance of a failed elite.
    There is SO MUCH we’ve been forced to accept, so much we’ve been bullied into tolerating, and the pandemic lockdown’s exposure of left-wing extremism in schools shocked the American middle class with just how insane and malevolent our elites have become.

    And we’re seeing that it’s NOT hopeless. The Left’s destructive victories are NOT permanent and irreversible. The degenerate political class we are presently saddled with is NOT the best we can do. We don’t have to settle for Dem totalitarianism OR Republican Failure Theater.
    One other grave miscalculation Dems made when they launched Operation SCOTUS Leak: Abortion is one of those issues that only works for the Left when it’s kept vague and hypothetical. The more specifics emerge, the more the public turns pro-life, i.e. the ultrasound revolution.

    The fight Dems picked over Roe v Wade is going to be filled with the kind of specifics that tend to pull moderate voters away from abortion extremism. For instance, the public generally favors rape and incest abortions – but they don’t realize how rare those really are.
    The default pro-abortion position is very vague and lazy. A lot of it boils down to men bullied into thinking they have nothing to say on the issue – which is illogical, immoral, and contrary to core American principles. Some of those guys wake up when you get into specifics.

    How could any American ever have subscribed to the sick and twisted notion that some citizens are not allowed to have an opinion on national issues, especially matters of life and death? It’s one of the ways Roe corrupted and weakened our society.
    I think we’ve had just about enough of arrogant lectures from elites and their extremist online footsoldiers about how this or that group of Americans needs to shut up, obey, and pay the bills. We all have not just the right, but the RESPONSIBILITY, to be awake and aware.

    Who knows how this SCOTUS fiasco will play out. Maybe intimidation tactics will work and justices will change their votes. Even if that happens, this whole operation is going to blow up in the Democrats’ faces, because they don’t have a clue how normal Americans think. /end

    About that coordination: see TommyJay’s comment here:
    https://www.thenewneo.com/2022/05/05/open-thread-5-5-22/#comment-2622204

    Note the dates. This rather polished political propaganda ad was released on the same day as the original Politico leak article. We don’t know when the leak was given to Politico, but at a minimum there was some collusion between some Politico people and the people producing the ad. Or it could have been the leaker bypassing Politico, but that would be worse.

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