Sneaky changes: Thomas’ English muffins
When I was a child, Thomas’ English muffins were a staple of my breakfast. They had crisp nooks and crannies into which butter loved to slide, and they were just the right combination of textures of soft and hard.
I hadn’t had one in years and years and years. And so the other day, when a display of them caught my eye, I thought, Why not? It’s been a long time. I had some leftover butter, too, from all the lebkuchen I’d made, and so I bought a package of the English muffins. The label said “Original” in big letters.
The first hint that something might be awry was the size of the muffin. When I got home, opened the package, and studied one, it seemed to have a smaller diameter than memory would have it.
Next, it was more difficult to separate than I recalled from the past. One of the things about English muffins is that they are semi-cut already, a sort of tear-along-dotted-line thing that makes them easier to separate and assures that they will have the proper number of small hills and valleys that knife-cutting could never provide. But now it seemed that the two halves wanted to stick together, or they wanted to separate in such a way that one half was almost paper-thin in spots while the other was too thick.
I toasted them. Spread butter on them. And took a bite.
They tasted – different. What was it? Blander? More doughy? The texture was spongier and gummier than memory. These were almost pillowlike, although they had a veneer of crustiness.
I wondered if it was my memory or if they had really changed. First I found this discussion where some people were complaining about the muffins and others reassuring them that all was well. And then I found this from the company itself:
Recipe for Greatness
STAYING TRUE TO OUR METHODS SINCE DAY ONE
–We still use quality ingredients to make all of our products
–We have stayed true to our methods
–We listen to our consumers and are actively involved in initiatives to make healthier products
–We encourage environmental processes, such as water recycling, in all of our plants.
First of all, let me get this pet peeve out of the way: it should be “more healthful products,” not “healthier products.” People and other living things can be healthy, products that promote good health are healthful. Ancient history, I know.
But my main observation is that what they don’t say is more interesting than what they do say. They don’t say, “We have never changed our recipe or our ingredients.” They don’t say, “We have never changed the size of our muffins.”
And so I bet they’ve changed both. And definitely for the worse.
I, too, fondly remember the English muffins of my youth. I could only have them in Teaneck, NJ, when I sometimes visited my father in the summers. I loved them, and there wasn’t an English muffin to be had back in South Dakota (at least not nearby). We always opened them by poking with a fork all around the circumference.
In the hardy outpost in the frigid north where I now live, St Cloud, MN, we can get Bay’s English muffins, and flavor- and texture-wise, they seem far more like the “original” Thomas muffins, except they’re pre-cut.
I also liked English muffins; found the contemporary offerings wanting, so set out to make ’em at home. Worth every bit of the effort, sez I (but I do like to bake and such). They freeze up semi-ok as well, so there’s that.
neo: I’ve been making eggs, bacon and a Thomas English muffin for breakfast almost everyday for twenty years. I hadn’t noticed the decline in diameter, though come to think of it, they do seem smaller.
I have noticed the gumminess and not liked it at all. My theory was that maybe they got soft and a little nasty from sitting on the store shelf too long. As a consequence I toast them hard but then they get too hard and a little burnt. That’s not appealing either.
But the cheaper alternatives are even worse.
The Oroweat Honey Wheatberry bread isn’t what I remember from the 70s either.
Then there is the terrible loss of Morton’s Honey Buns, a super sugary treat, eaten slathered with butter, when I was a kid.
Turns out there is even a web page mourning Honey Buns:
But the real star was Morton Honey Buns. Morton Honey Buns came four to a package, and there was so much sugar on each that when you pulled the buns out, the sugar frosting was all over the package and the four came out like a brick.
But the brand is gone, nowhere to be found. And since the launch of the BrandlandUSA blog, we have discovered it is one of the top searched for dead brands on our site. People far and wide are searching for Morton, but cannot find it. While we knew Morton’s was a personal favorite, until we launched the blog, we didn’t know how many others loved the brand too. Apparently, they are mostly searching for the Morton Honey Buns, and not so much the Pot Pies, though those get requests too.
http://www.brandlandusa.com/2007/07/22/bring-back-morton-honey-buns/
How many other old favorites have been very quietly “transformed” over the decades?
One I noticed was Cherios, with a distinct change in flavor several years ago.
Then, of course, there are all the products which have stealthily been increased in price by reducing their size/weight, or the capacity of the package they come in; tricks done to fool you like those restaurants that reduce the size of their dinner plates, or the 3/4 size furniture you sometimes see in model homes.
Then, there are those old timey animal cookies in the circus themed box, which have had the circus animals released from their traditional cage, since caging them was obviously so, so cruel.
And on and on.
These days there are room-temperature honey buns sold in convenience stores which look pretty icky.
From what I’ve read these honey buns are used as currency in Southern prisons like cigarettes.
By contrast, honey buns are a sugary mass of fried dough. “They’re sooo good!” said prisoner Thomas Lamb, who said he eats at least one honey bun a day. What honey buns are is extremely unhealthy. “Actually, honey buns are a heart attack in a bag,” observed prisoner Larry Roberson.
The Florida prison system sells a 6-ounce Mrs. Freshley’s Grand Honey Bun for $1.08. It contains 680 calories, 51 grams of sugar and 30 grams of fat, and is covered with a sticky white frosting that provides a pervasive taste of sugar.
…
Honey buns also serve as prison currency, and violence can ensue when they are stolen or not forthcoming to pay a debt – the darker side of this sweet confection.
https://www.prisonlegalnews.org/news/2011/jul/15/the-incredible-honey-bun-behind-bars/
I was at a restaurant at a water park resort last week and had Eggs Benedict and noticed the EXACT SAME THING! Gummy, not crisp. Bad enough, but imagine it with egg yolk and some hollandaise sauce.
I was going to give feedback on that issue, but now I guess it wasn’t their fault.
Might be your toaster.
The toasters of my youth were fiery things that torched the bread. Today’s toasters are wimpy and limp.
There’s a clearly implied contradiction here:
–We have stayed true to our methods
–We listen to our consumers and are actively involved in initiatives to make healthier products
Staying true to “our methods” is the implication of continuity, old-fashioned, what’s done now is the same as the old. But this implication is not quite said.
“initiatives to make healthier products” means changes for the better, at least better health.
I’m pretty sure they’re doing something different, for “health” reasons, which they claim is part of their “methods”. But it’s a change. I do wonder what they changed to be more gummy. Some alt-gluten or gluten-substitute?
There used to be lots of baking with lard. It was far better than similar baking with margarine, and often better than the “same” product done with butter. If the original had lard, no new lard-less product is going to be as good, for many folk. I miss the baking others would do with lard.
}}} People and other living things can be healthy, products that promote good health are healthful.
Vegetables are sensual.
PEOPLE are sensuous…
– Marion Wormer
😀
They are properly called ‘macaffuffins,’ as any toddler can tell you.
Recipe for sadness. “STAYING TRUE TO OUR METHODS SINCE DAY ONE.” What then follows is an exercise in verbal casuistry. The one blazing truth: “We are ACTIVELY involved in INITIATIVES to make HEALTHIER products. ‘Nuff said. I had wondered why I had lost my once-compelling interest in Thomas’ English Muffins. Your post is the answer. I give the company points in a sort of back-handed way — they have not stooped (as far as I know) to posting those two most dispiriting and disappointing words on their package: NEW IMPROVED!
I don’t think they’ve changed. I think your memories might be hard to live up to, Neo. As for the other junk in their info, doesn’t that refer to the multiple forms of muffins they have added to their repertoire? Some are whole wheat, some are yadda yadda yadda other faddist flavor. And I think one might be a bigger model, only four to the box, with a wider diameter. That would suggest (to me, at least) that the regular is still the same size as 10, 20, 30 years ago.
I’m sure they have changed the recipe. First, because I, too, noticed a difference. Second, that’s the way some businesses work. Manufacturers are always looking for alternative materials to either make their products better in some way, or cheaper but still resembling the product. Over time the end product “drifts” further and further away from the original product, so we get stuff which is not what we fondly remember.
Years ago I read a book called, “Twinkie deconstucted”, I think. It explains all the recipe changes to the Twinkie recipe over the years.
Now, I think hot dogs are nowhere near the good tasting stuff they used to be.
I don’t think they’ve changed. I think your memories might be hard to live up to, Neo.
Kai Akker: Or perhaps your memories are faulty. A quick web survey reveals that neo, myself and other commenters here are not alone:
But old Uncle Thomas has changed his recipe or something because these Thomas’ English Muffins are small and are lacking the nook. Lacking the cranny. They’re hard to cut in half. They don’t brown up nice in the toaster. They’re a tad on the ‘mealy’ side. They’re horrible. Possibly the worst english muffin on the market.
http://www.viewpoints.com/Thomas-English-Muffins-reviews
i am not sure if the taste has gone downhill but i do know the cutting of them is terrible. You end up with one side so thin it is useless. There is no uniform shape to them. For the price i will just buy the store brand and get a muffin that is decent. Done with Thomass.
https://iaintnooprah.blogspot.com/2008/06/thomas-english-muffins.html
Is it me or do Thomas English Muffins have a sour off taste? I’ve eaten these since I was a kid, but seems in the last few years they’re tasting funny. They’re also a little raggy and don’t toast very well. I do like a good sour dough bread, so I don’t think that’s the problem. I’ve switched to Bay’s English Muffins found in the dairy case and they’re great. Won’t be going back. Any opinions out there?
https://www.chowhound.com/post/thomas-english-muffins-766451
Vegetables are sensual.
Yours might be. Ours are edible.
PEOPLE are sensuous…
I find Kirsten Dunst sensual.
You really find a couple internet opinions that something was better once in the past conclusive, Huxley?
Kai Akker: I do know you are not one to doubt the indisputable superiority of your own opinions, no matter what.
Do you always find your opinions conclusive, no matter how many people disagree, Kai Akker?
Ritz crackers as well. Finished one box, went and bought another. Could tell right away they had changed for the worse.
Huxley, really! Calmate. I gave my opinion; can’t help that it seems to bother you.
The original change in Thomas’s English muffins from my childhood was when they made the side perforations — to make them easier to separate. I was sorry to see those, thinking they would affect the taste or freshness or the nooks and crannies, but they really didn’t seem to. That was probably 40 or more years ago.
Now Thomas’ are made by Bimbo Bakeries, the Mexican-based bakery. Bimbo bought a group of brands in 2001, including Sara Lee, Freihofer’s, and Thomas’, according to their website.
So they have recently made a change in the English muffins. They have made them bigger. Here is my chat with a customer service rep named Pattie:
Contact No: 001749949A
Michael 12/27/19 16:43:23 – Has the recipe for Thomas’s English Muffins changed since Bimbo has been baking them? Also, has the size of the muffin changed?
12/27/19 16:43:23 – ** Thank you for waiting. You are number 1 in line.
12/27/19 16:43:55 – Thank you for waiting. You are now talking with Pattie.
Pattie 12/27/19 16:44:07 – Hello Michael.
Pattie 12/27/19 16:44:41 – Have the change that you notice been recent? Bimbo has been the parent company for Thomas since 2001.
Michael 12/27/19 16:45:26 – So has there been a change, Pattie?
Pattie 12/27/19 16:45:50 – No there have been no changes that we have been made aware.
Michael 12/27/19 16:46:12 – Not in the recipe; and not in the size either?
Pattie 12/27/19 16:46:44 – Do you have a UPC/BAR code that I can research your question with?
Michael 12/27/19 16:47:39 – I have a package in the refrigerator, LOL! But I am reading people on the internet saying the muffins don’t taste the same, and might even be smaller. I was curious to know.
Pattie 12/27/19 16:48:02 – I see no current change in any of our Thomas products.
Michael 12/27/19 16:49:04 – Current?
Pattie 12/27/19 16:49:35 – I am not aware of any current or recent changes in any
Michael 12/27/19 16:49:38 – Did they change in 2001 when Bimbo took ownership of the brand, perhaps?
Pattie 12/27/19 16:49:49 – Thomas product, to further research I need the UPC/BAR code.
Michael 12/27/19 16:50:12 – 48121 10208
Pattie 12/27/19 16:53:29 – The only change I see is that in 2019 the size of the muffin increased which changed the weight of the product from 12oz to 13oz. Other than that no other size, recipe changes have been made.
Pattie 12/27/19 16:54:33 – Is there anything else I can help you with?
Michael 12/27/19 16:55:11 – My package, with that bar code, is 12 ozs. When did that size change occur, are you able to tell me?
Pattie 12/27/19 16:57:30 – Can you tell me the expiration date and the coding that is on that plastic tab?
Michael 12/27/19 16:58:52 – No, the plastic tab is gone; just a twist now. I bought three or four boxes at one time and froze some. This is the last one, so it could have been bought in October or even in September, not sure.
Pattie 12/27/19 17:00:48 – Yes, I am not sure of the exact date of this change, just that it occurred in 2019.
Pattie 12/27/19 17:01:03 – Other than that change I see no other change with this product.
Pattie 12/27/19 17:01:09 – Is there anything else I can help you with?
Michael 12/27/19 17:01:14 – OK, thanks, Pattie! I appreciate your time and effort!
Pattie 12/27/19 17:01:37 – You are welcome, have a good day.
Pattie 12/27/19 17:01:38 – Thank you. If you have further questions, please feel free to contact us again, 1-800-984-0989. They can best answer your questions. Have a great day!
Confirmation #001749949A.
Me back again — these are a unique product. Not quite Coca-Cola, but Thomas’ English muffins are a prized product. Anyone making a change to them would be risking that special quality. I wouldn’t know anything about flour or such changes; I suspect flour can vary over time. But I just don’t see any clear sign of a change, except this apparent fact that they are now being made a tiny bit bigger.
Bimbo is a Mexican corporation, but Bimbo USA is headquartered in Horsham, Pa., a suburb of Philadelphia. I just passed a Bimbo Bakery in Plymouth Meeting or Conshohocken last week, and I noticed they were doing a big expansion and upgrade. Maybe that was for this new 13-oz package size…. : ) The Bimbo name always struck me, when I saw it; seems a pleasantly silly or unsophisticated name! So it was surprising to learn that they apparently own these high-end brands.
I too was very disappointed the last time I bought Thomas’s. Our store brand is much better.
Kai Akker:
Perhaps you are comparing a different generation of “original” muffins. My childhood may have been considerably earlier than yours.
Perhaps. I don’t know your age.
But the change really has not been subtle. It is very very noticeable, particularly the texture.
If you look at the ingredients, you’ll see that among them are various preservatives that probably weren’t used when I was a child. That may account in part for the change in texture and taste. The change in size is also real. It is quite noticeable. And although they may have recently made them bigger than they were just a little while ago, that’s irrelevant to the fact that they’re smaller in diameter than they were when I was a child. They may even have the same weight as they did back then, but their dimensions are different.
Kai Akker:
I don’t know when the bread additives began in the US, but I just found this article that says it happened in 1961 in Britain. That would be a bit later than the period of my childhood I’m talking about. So it your childhood memories are 1961 or later, you may be comparing Thomas’ 2.0 to my Thomas’ 1.0.
From the article:
That’s the sort of textural change I’m talking about. Gummy and doughy, and it tastes different, too. I don’t know whether US bread uses that exact process, but I would bet it uses something much like it.
Overall, I agree… They have changed over my 77 years of life. A few years back they had a sourdough variant that I particularly enjoyed. Seems to have disappeared from the shelves now. One other significant change was mentioned above, or perhaps that should be below, the toaster. Today’s are low power compared to earlier ones. One way around that is to just use the oven broiler. Or attend yard sales until you get lucky.
Have you eaten a drumstick ice cream cone lately? They’ve shrunk, about half the size they once were. And the chocolate top often collapses since the ice cream underneath it does not fill the whole space. And only last week I bought a box of Hostess Zingers. They are so small it is pathetic. Not even half the size they once were.
Kai,
Get a grip. Of course they are different. They are being MADE BY BIMBOS!
What is the nature of BIMBOS? They are the enegry source for BIMBO ERUPTIONS!
What are BIMBO ERUPTIONS?
They are Clintonesque phenomena.
Hence anything you are told by a SPOKESDEMON FOR BIMBO is something from THE MOTHERSATAN OF ALL LIES!!!
Whew.
Do try to keep up.
Bimbo is actually a HUGE name in bread throughout Latin America. I would say it is the equivalent of what Wonder used to be in the sixties and seventies.
The first time I saw it I found it to be a strange and funny brand name. But, there is nothing funny about 162 billion in market capitalization…
https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/BIMBOA:MM
I suspect flour can vary over time.
Flour varies a lot between brands. I was making bread regularly for a while and was surprised at the difference in the amount of kneading required.
And now a carton of Hagen Daz – ‘The Pint Sized Company’ – is 14oz.!
I should probably not complain, since once I get started I’ll eat a whole carton of Chocolate in a sitting…
The Thomas muffin language is thoroughly typical of our times: blandly reassuring that the company and its product(s) are on our side, while telling us very little other than semi-musical babble.
The same approach is everywhere.
The Bimbo name is pronounced “Beem-bo”. I’ve met with the U.S. operations folks, sold them my company’s stuff. If I had to guess it would be that they swapped out shortening from the recipe, to make the muffins more healthful, or something. Personally I eat English muffins with my breakfast a few times per week, but switched to Bays several years ago.
Molly Brown:
And then there’s what happened to the Breyers’ cartons – they changed shape and became curved to shave off volume, and then the entire thing got smaller, and then a lot smaller.
Breakfast this morning consisted of a Thomas’. Doughy. I don’t like anything overly toasted so the day started poorly. Today’s Thomas’ ain’t what it used to be.
Mother’s English Tea Cookies survived the death and resurrection of the company a dozen years ago, only to be changed in size, shape, and texture sometime last year.
They were my favorite cookie. My mother (no relation to the eponymous Mother) used to send them to me in care packages during college since they weren’t available in New England.
Pardon me while I go wave my cane at the clouds.
I agree definitely gummier. Store brand rye bread is like that too.
Guess we ve got to buy the artisan breads. NE market basket chain has * jessicas breads* nice and dry not gummy but alas she dosen t do English Muffins.
In 2010, the company won a trade secret suit when an executive uploaded the company’s recipes and retired to work for Hostess. Annual sales in 2010 for Thomas’ English Muffins was estimated to be US$500 million
THOMAS’S SUES TO KEEP ENGLISH MUFFIN SECRETS
By The Associated Press
Nov. 10, 1982
All English muffins are not created equal. And the bakers at Thomas’s aim to keep it that way. The nation’s leading muffin maker is going to court to prevent three former employees from revealing a 102-year-old secret – how to make muffins with lots of yawning nooks and crannies to hold the melted butter, as the advertisements say.
S.B. Thomas Inc. of Totowa, N.J., filed suit in New Jersey to keep the former employees from giving the English muffin recipe to their new employer – and Thomas’s new competitor – Entenmann.
Michael Sayeau, a spokesman for CPC International Inc., Thomas’s parent company, said he believed there was ”a possibility” that the former employees divulged trade secrets. Jack Sholl, a spokesman for the Warner-Lambert Company, parent of Entenmann, said the suit has ”no merit” but declined further comment.
Thomas’s English Muffins and the recipe the company calls ”original and distinctive” have been around since 1880. Entenmann, another old baking name, recently developed its own English muffin and has been test-marketing the product.
[skip]
English muffins, round and less than an inch thick, are usually served split and toasted. Although their heritage is English, they have only recently returned to that country, where they are called ”Yankee Doodles.”
The first muffins were made from leftover dough, which gave them a sour flavor, and they were cooked on a griddle in oil. Later, flour replaced oil and rice replaced flour. Today’s muffin is baked on cornmeal.
“If the original had lard, no new lard-less product is going to be as good…” Tom Grey
There is really no satisfactory substitute for lard in pastry.
Everything with shortening is an also-ran.
Butter is best for sweet doughs.
Story on commercialization I read somewhere years ago, roughly paraphrased:
The originators of Hidden Valley Ranch dressing were working on a recipe that would be as good as the original, sold by the developer only at his dude ranch, but still have the stability needed for shelf life.
They kept rejecting formulations because they didn’t taste as good as the original, until finally some one pointed out that most potential customers didn’t know what the original tasted like — after which they just picked the closest approximation that could go to market.
The original was made with buttermilk, mayonnaise, and “secret spices”; my mother used to buy the spice packets and we would make our own, before the bottled dressing became available.
Here’s the hook for this thread: The brand was later bought by Clorox.
“Meanwhile, Clorox reformulated the Hidden Valley Ranch dressing several times to make it more convenient for consumers. The first change was to include buttermilk flavoring in the seasoning, meaning much less expensive regular milk could be used to mix the dressing instead.”
I can vaguely remember noticing that, somewhere along the line, Ranch Dressing quit tasting like what I remembered my mother mixing up in the sixties.
Artfldgr:
Yes, I had seen that 1982 article about the lawsuit. I figure, though, that the change-up probably happened since then.
And then there is the new federal category of “natural flavor” [“Tastes Sort of Like….”] which is usually a “trade secret”. It is a concern for me due to several food allergies/sensitivities. I did get a laugh [but no information] from one representative when I pointed out that “three-day old possum road kill drippings” would qualify as a “natural flavor”. Apparently, the flavor in Big Mac’s fries is delivered in drums and made from wheat protein to avoid the concerns of “vegans” and others who don’t want to eat beef.
I am pretty sure that the Gates of Hell will have a sign,”Heaven, New And Improved. All Natural””.
Good luck..
FYI:
“The name “Bimbo” was first coined in 1945 when the company switched from Super Pan S.A. A blend of the words “bingo” and “Bambi”, the name’s innocent, childlike associations fit the image that the company wished to build. The English word “bimbo”, with its negative connotations, has no cognate in Spanish.”
I have gotten many amused reactions from explaining in Lat Am that, in English, a “bimbo” is a young woman of questionable intellect, but viewed by some as attractive for her physical qualities and easy access to the same.
There is also the phenomenon of what we might call “shaving” i.e.–cutting down on the weight of more expensive or harder to produce metal used in a product by making formerly sturdy, heavy duty metal parts cruder in form and/or just robust enough to last a minimum amount of time and/or replacing sturdier metal parts with plastic ones.
Pick up any appliance from several decades ago or, especially earlier, and it is usually heavier than today’s version, because it was constructed using a lot of metal parts and, quite often, this robust metal construction made it last quite a long time.
Moving into a house several decades ago, we decided to replace a gas stove–painted a disgusting “avacado green”–and noted that its repacement was far lighter in weight, and far less robust in construction, and the same could be said about other major household appliances, about cars, etc.
The aim here is not, as in the past, to make a product sturdy enough to last for as long possible, it is increasingly to deliberately make a product that will last for a far shorter amount of time, so that a new replacement will soon have to be bought, increasing the profits of that product’s producers.
Similarly, new “throw away” products are hard to/expensive to repair, making replacing them a better option, and I do not think that this state of affairs is accidental.
This was a major change in philosophy, pride in you work, and the aim of turning out a good, long-lasting product, as–over many decades–hand-made items gave way to assembly lines and, then, assembly lines sped up, workers had less skills and less time to devote to individual products and, it appears, many companies started to take less care with and had less pride in their products, kept looking for ways to cut corners, and profit became the dominant concern.
Lighter in weight is not necessarily better.
Funny (or interesting) that you should have mentioned the change in Thomas’ English muffins. My mother used to give them to us several times a year, and when I moved out I didn’t have them for probably a few decades. When I again bought Thomas English muffins and tried them for the first time in probably 20 years, it seemed to me as if they were smaller, chewier, and not as memorable as they had been years earlier.
OTOH, I remember my mother putting butter on the muffins and then toasting them in the broiler. That resulted in a golden brown product that was crisp without charring. I thought this might explain the difference between today’s product and what my mother served.
No matter if they are truly unchanged, a little larger under Bimbo’s production, or chewier and harder to split (with a fork, please!), the Thomas muffins I have tried several times in the last 10 years or so do not stand up to my memory of what I had in my mother’s kitchen. I have pretty well gotten away from eating Thomas English muffins any longer.
And many other food products have gone through unhappy changes too: ice cream now comes in containers that are significantly smaller, and just this week I hurriedly picked up a container of half-and-half in the market without reading the label closely. I thought it looked and tasted like skim milk when I got it home. Sure enough, the label that I did not read closely enough said “fat-free half-and-half”. I thought the whole purpose of half-and-half was to have a dairy product with increased fat content? WTH?
I remember my mother putting butter on the muffins and then toasting them in the broiler [F]
Right. My grandmother did it the same way when I was first exposed to these things a long time ago. And, as Estoy Listo said, toasters aren’t the same now, either. Who still toasts these muffins in one of those double-sided blast furnaces from the past? More likely in a toaster oven, on any number of possible settings, including top-side only.
So there are a lot of ways they could differ that may not be from the recipe.
But the change really has not been subtle. It is very very noticeable, particularly the texture.
If you look at the ingredients, you’ll see that among them are various preservatives that probably weren’t used when I was a child. That may account in part for the change in texture and taste. The change in size is also real. It is quite noticeable. [Neo]
Those are facts, Neo? Or your own (strongly held) opinions? That 6-pack packaging has been constant, to the best of my knowledge, for decades, and these muffins have filled that pack consistently in all that time. I ate half of one this morning to double-check my impressions on taste and appearance, and my opinion is that these English muffins are as close to the same product as 50 years ago as anything on a grocery shelf. I don’t detect any significant change.
While we’re at it, how about the vegetables in our supermarkets, particularly tomatoes.
It was a revelation when I started to grow tomatoes, and read that the chief reason that I was getting rock hard, tasteless tomatoes with pale interiors at the supermarket was that usually better tasting but usually not prettier looking tomato varieties–like various “heirloom” varieties–were not stocked in favor of tomato varieties that, instead, stood up better to transportation and storage, and supposedly had a better exterior appearance.
So the hell with taste, it was all about the convenience and profits of the retailer.
Yes, I had seen that 1982 article about the lawsuit. I figure, though, that the change-up probably happened since then.
yup… when the left, controlling the means of production made it illegal to use certain oils and fats in foods and restaurants… why mcdonalds fries dont taste as great as they used to either…
this was to save us from the fats we are now learning are not the cause of things
how do we know? easy, the population became one big experiment!!! same with other things… they change something by mandate pretending they “know” and the population is the ginnea pigs and if something goes bad, the pharma company and all the other drugs end up paying for it in increased prices..
its interesting to know that the stuff that is playing with peoples cholesterol, doesnt help most people…. it also hurts many… and is being (wrongly) used as a preventative… ie. start it early… but by doing that, your running the ‘tests’ for the state.. who cant be sued, and cant be held responsible…
Contact your doctor if you experience serious side effects of Lipitor including:
muscle wasting and muscle breakdown (rhabdomyolysis),
confusion or memory problems,
fever,
dark urine,
increased thirst or hunger,
drowsiness,
loss of appetite, or.
yellowing of the skin or eyes (jaundice).
Why are we still in the middle of a ‘statins war’?
“Many people are at low risk for heart attack or stroke and do not need to take a statin. Statins are intended to be used by people at high risk of heart disease.”
Joseph A. Hill, M.D., Ph.D.
at 55 i had my blood vessels scanned, and they ALL came up 0… nothing.. nada… and yet, they wanted to put me on statins for the rest of my life…
do note that if they DO prescribe to those who dont really need it, they will then have those people coming in for more frequent checkups and for treating side effects they would not have..
turns out i am healthier for NOT going to the doctors…
while i dont recommend that for many, i myself am better off..
This is up there with the Eggs are bad for you
10 years 15 years later, now eggs are back on the menu
the experiment on the population is over..
🙁
Artfldgr:
I have to say I’ve been pleased that they took eggs out of the doghouse.
I like eggs. I figure we all better eat a lot of them before “they” decide to disapprove of them again 🙂 .
Kai Akker:
Facts. Those preservatives were not in them when I was a child, which was a lot more than 50 years ago. And as the excerpts I posted in that comment indicated, there are almost certainly other changes too that are not reflected in the labeling.
The size difference is quite obvious to me and to many others.
So perhaps you are remembering a version that was already changed from the version I’m talking about.
Tom Grey and Aesop get it right: For baking, LARD RULES!
(Some people put Crisco into “butter-cream” frosting, I assume as a stabilizer against melting. Please don’t do that.)
And according to my Dad, who was professionally familiar with and used to deep-fat frying, again Lard Rules. (Although he and others have complained about the odor. I can’t say I’ve noticed it…. Speaking of which, I understand that the reason why McFries were once the Wonder of the West was that they were fried in — hold your tummy — suet! Well I mean, I never!) Today’s McFries are just … average.
Suet is also used in traditional British mincemeat, as in mince pies and other dishes. (Interesting info at Spruce Eats:
https://www.thespruceeats.com/what-is-suet-and-alternatives-to-suet-in-british-food-435414 .)
A few years ago, coconut oil or shortening was all the rage as the Best Evah for frying. Bought some. Haven’t tried it yet.
Anybody? Bueller? Bueller?
…
Oh yeah. “Eggs are Nature’s perfect food.” Thus said (probably) the Egg Board, and we ‘uns were certainly brought up on eggs and taught that they were an important part of the Dairy Foods layer of the Food Pyramid.
In the ’50s.
I never stopped eating eggs. I’m not stupid! *smug smirk*
P.S. That is, as a rule Lard Rules. I wouldn’t use lard instead of butter in butter cookies, or shortbread, or butter cake. Unless they were to be eaten by somebody with lactose intolerance, I suppose.
UPDATE. The Internet, which is 100% trustworthy & reliable *g*, says that most lactose-intolerant people can eat butter (I suppose not in the amounts I, who am in love with butter, use) because the lactose in it is very, very small. For those relatively few, and for those who want to eat cheese, some recommend Lactaid as containing the enzyme that helps digest the lactose and that lactose-intolerant people lack.
.
And of course, some are allergic to eggs or to egg white. It’s difficult to make angel-food cake without egg whites. Or meringue for pies and puddings, but then again, I don’t care for meringue toppings. Meringue cookies are another matter. :>))
I wish to put in a good word for salt rising bread as the king of all buttered toasts.
That is all.
They are different, smaller and not as good. I think they have reduced the amount of egg in the recipe, hence the more mealier, doughy consistency.
‘Bay’s’ makes a pretty decent English muffin, if you can find them – they’re normally up in the refrigerated cheese display.
Package sizes have generally been decreasing markedly over the past couple of years, it would almost seem as if a box of Triscuits or Ritz crackers will just about fit into one of your hip pockets.
@neo:Facts. Those preservatives were not in them when I was a child, which was a lot more than 50 years ago.
Did you happen to save a carton, to compare the list of ingredients? Because otherwise how would you know? Preservatives have been used in commercial food for a very long time, and everything that is in Thomas’ muffins today certainly was in mass-produced food going to back to the 40s and 50s.
Below see the ingredients for today’s “original” muffins. There are three preservatives there, calcium propionate, sorbic acid, soy lecithin. All of them have been used in mass-produced baked goods for many decades. It’s not as though they COULD NOT have been in your childhood muffins, though I grant you it’s not proof they were.
ENRICHED WHEAT FLOUR [FLOUR, MALTED BARLEY FLOUR, REDUCED IRON, NIACIN, THIAMIN MONONITRATE (VITAMIN B1), RIBOFLAVIN (VITAMIN B2), FOLIC ACID], WATER, FARINA, YEAST, SALT, SUGAR, CALCIUM PROPIONATE AND SORBIC ACID (TO PRESERVE FRESHNESS), SOYBEAN OIL, WHEAT GLUTEN, GRAIN VINEGAR, SOY LECITHIN, SOY, WHEY (MILK).
‘Bay’s’ makes a pretty decent English muffin, if you can find them [Aggie]
Bay’s are also made by Bimbo.
https://www.bimbobakeriesusa.com/brands
They are different, smaller and not as good. I think they have reduced the amount of egg in the recipe, hence the more mealier, doughy consistency. [Aggie]
Aggie, note ingredients as listed by Frederick above. There are no eggs in Thomas’ English muffins. There are no eggs in Bay’s English muffins either. The Fannie Farmer cookbook does not list eggs in its English muffin recipe. I think it’s clear we have a lot of opinions about English muffins for which there is very little basis!
Frederick:
Minor point, soy lecithin is an emulsifier not a preservative in food use. Neo may be remembering the preservatives BHT and BHA (antioxidants) that were commonly used in baked goods but now aren’t. Green fuzzy bread is natural, just don’t eat it.
Neo, I blame you! You, you, you! Update from the front lines of the English muffin wars to follow.
OK, so I went to the store today and Thomas’ were buy-1, get-1-free. And I checked — yes, there are the 13-oz package, not the 12-oz of the recent and maybe forever past.
You folks who think the muffins shrank and therefore are inferior will be happy. Happy! They look bigger. Much bigger! That 8% difference in weight translates into a noticeably bigger muffin — very noticeably.
So what’s not to like?! OK…. coming up.
From Neo’s original post:
Next, it was more difficult to separate than I recalled from the past…. now it seemed that the two halves wanted to stick together, or they wanted to separate in such a way that one half was almost paper-thin in spots while the other was too thick.
OMG. Please. One half was almost paper-thin, the other too thick. Hello! This is what Thomas’ English muffins aspire to be!! Non-uniform! That is how it has those “nooks and crannies”!
The top half is the smaller half. The bottom is the bigger, and the flatter. That has something to do with the original recipe and baking equipment, obviously. And it has been carefully perpetuated.
But NOW…. Neo, you have had your wish fulfilled. The two halves of these bigger muffins are virtually identical in size and shape. And virtually identical in nooks and crannies. They are
UNIFORM
Aargh. That is terrible to a true Thomas’ fan. That is what almost all the cheapie knockoffs are like.
[pausing to take a breath]
How could this be? How could a 1/12th increase change the nature of the muffin’s mysterious interior so drastically?
I don’t know. Bimbo’s TOLD ME (Vanderleun please note) that only the weight was changed. But…..
[small sob] this great Mexican corporation may have…..
… lied to me.
Something is different. It is NOT an improvement.
Please note, my sample size is one. I toasted my last 12-oz specimen and followed immediately with my first 13-oz specimen. Results could conceivably vary over the remaining five in the package.
And they better! Otherwise, Neo, I blame you!
“Kai Akker on December 29, 2019 at 9:49 am said: ”
“I think it’s clear we have a lot of opinions about English muffins for which there is very little basis!”
I don’t know about that, but there are plenty of English Muffin recipes out there that have an egg in them. Rather than telling you to go suck an egg, I’ll just wish you the best in finding the muffin of your dreams.
I know the size, texture and taste have changed. It’s a little bit at a time but “everyone’s doing it” so why not Thomas’/Bimbo? But, today I had one of their new Buttermilk ones and just the smell took me back to my childhood kitchen. I think that might be the missing ingredient but I can’t seem to find out. All I know is it smelled and tasted like home
RE: Thomas’ English muffins: I couldn’t care less about size; English muffins are all about the nooks and crannies, which have definitely been dramatically decreased in recent Thomas’ muffins
RE: Statins. Big pharma sells the statins like a drug dealer pushes crack. Almost any article regarding the side effects is also full of the results of sponsored anti-research clearly intended to counter the bad news. (Loss of muscle mass, for god’s sake, like older people need more of that!?) and painful cramping (my husband suffered from this so badly, the doctor had to go through two alternatives to find one that didn’t cause it). The mechanism is genetic:
see https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2023/06/the-gene-that-explains-statins-most-puzzling-side-effect/674542/.
I’m not saying nobody should take them; obviously clogged arteries are a problem, but pay attention to what your body tells you, and if you notice any muscle weakness or cramping, look for better ways to lower your cholesterol, or/and make your doctor prescribe an alternative. Don’t let them bully you or overwhelm you with big Pharma’s disinformation campaign.
Kristine Wolf has brought this three and a half year old thread to life and I agree; it is just the thread we need to right our once great nation on her course of freedom, justice and prosperity!
Regarding Thompson’s English Muffins; neo’s experience mirrors mine except I always added some preserves or jelly after the butter melted into the nooks and crannies. I too bought some to try to relive that childhood memory and am fairly confident their size was diminished. Even worse; “What was it? Blander? More doughy? The texture was spongier and gummier than memory.”
The founders of our nation had it right when they freed us from British rule and evicted the limey b*st*rds from our shores! A nation that would destroy such a product for short term profit is unfit to govern free women and men. A pox on the House of Hanover!
I found this thread because I was looking to see if anyone else thinks Thomas English muffins are gooey, even after toasting well. I just can’t stand the texture! I have tried Bay’s and other store brands. They’re okay, but just not what I’m looking for. Has anyone found another brand they like?
Lisa – No first-hand experience, but the ‘whole-grain w/butter’ looks best … imo : )
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=english+muffins&t=h_&ia=images&iax=images
Let them eat crumpets…
My husband and I agree—they definitely do not taste the same. We were disappointed. They were buy one get one free so I bought two. We each ate one out of the pack and threw the rest away. Total waste of money.