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Looking back: remember that debate between Romney and Obama about Russia? — 15 Comments

1. Romney claimed that Russia was ‘our number one geopolitical foe’.

   It perhaps won’t come as a surprise but at that time I don’t think that Romney was correct, in that China was at that time a far greater geopolitical threat.

   Currently the potential for nuclear conflict with Russia does elevate them to our number one geopolitical concern because rather than making efforts to deescalate the conflict, the Biden administration with the full cooperation of Congress is escalating the conflict.

2. Geoffrey, tell me who has been threatening the west with nuclear weapons in the last few weeks?

   I shouldn’t have to give you a hint.

   Your assertion is particularly “droll” given Brandon’s statements and actions prior
   to the invasion

3. }}} Why was our intelligence community caught flat-footed about Putin’s moves?

   Now we know…

   They were already spending all their time investigating Obama’s opposition. :-/

4. Geoffrey Britain:

   The transcript of the debate is here. Let’s look at what Romney said. This was right after Obama and Romney were talking about the threat that Middle Eastern terrorism represented to the US:

   PRESIDENT OBAMA: Governor Romney, I’m glad that you recognize that al-Qaida’s a threat because a few months ago when you were asked, what’s the biggest geopolitical threat facing America, you said Russia — not al-Qaida, you said Russia. And the 1980s are now calling to ask for their foreign policy back because, you know, the Cold War’s been over for 20 years.

   But, Governor, when it comes to our foreign policy, you seem to want to import the foreign policies of the 1980s, just like the social policies of the 1950s and the economic policies of the 1920s…

   MR. ROMNEY: Well, of course I don’t concur with what the president said about my own record and the things that I’ve said. They don’t happen to be accurate. But — but I can say this: that we’re talking about the Middle East and how to help the Middle East reject the kind of terrorism we’re seeing and the rising tide of tumult and — and confusion. And — and attacking me is not an agenda. Attacking me is not talking about how we’re going to deal with the challenges that exist in the Middle East and take advantage of the opportunity there and stem the tide of this violence.

   But I’ll respond to a couple of the things you mentioned. First of all, Russia, I indicated, is a geopolitical foe, not —

   PRESIDENT OBAMA: Number one —

   MR. ROMNEY: Excuse me. It’s a geopolitical foe. And I said in the same — in the same paragraph, I said, and Iran is the greatest national security threat we face. Russia does continue to battle us in the U.N. time and time again. I have clear eyes on this. I’m not going to wear rose-colored glasses when it comes to Russia or Mr. Putin, and I’m certainly not going to say to him, I’ll give you more flexibility after the election. After the election he’ll get more backbone.

   The context of that part of the debate was vs. the Middle East. China was not part of the discussion.

   So, what did Romney say in that earlier statement that Obama was referencing? It wasn’t a speech; it was an interview with Wolf Blitzer:

   “Russia, this is, without question, our number one geopolitical foe,” Romney, who would be the Republican presidential nominee in the 2012 race against President Barack Obama, told Wolf Blitzer in March of that year. “They — they fight every cause for the world’s worst actors.”

   That’s what Romney meant by geopolitical foe. He didn’t mean economic foe or cyber foe. The following was the context [emphasis mine]:

   He was reacting to a hot-mic moment between Obama and then-Russian President Dmitry Medvedev earlier in 2012. In that exchange, Obama told Medvedev: “This is my last election. And after my election, I have more flexibility.”
   Republicans were up in arms, insisting that Obama was taking a hard line with Russia publicly while, apparently, making clear to the country’s leader that he was open to compromise.
   In his original interview, Blitzer was asking Romney about Russia in the context of that Obama hot-mic moment. And while his comment about Russia as America’s “number one geopolitical foe” is what drew the most attention and derision, it was far from the only comment Romney made about that subject in his interview with Blitzer.
   “Russia is not a friendly character on the world stage,” Romney said at one point. “And for this President to be looking for greater flexibility, where he doesn’t have to answer to the American people in his relations with Russia, is very, very troubling, very alarming.”
   Pressed by Blitzer on his assertion about the threat posed by Russia, Romney added this:
   “Well, I’m saying in terms of a geopolitical opponent, the nation that lines up with the world’s worst actors. Of course, the greatest threat that the world faces is a nuclear Iran. A nuclear North Korea is already troubling enough.
   “But when these — these terrible actors pursue their course in the world and we go to the United Nations looking for ways to stop them, when — when Assad, for instance, is murdering his own people, we go — we go to the United Nations, and who is it that always stands up for the world’s worst actors?

   “It is always Russia, typically with China alongside.”

   Romney was right.

   I think it’s always a good rule of thumb, when discussing a quote, to research the details of the quote.

5. Geoffrey Britain:

   It’s also so interesting that you place the blame for Putin’s aggression escalation on Biden and Congress’s reaction to it.

   Although I suppose that you may be correct that if we had just said to Putin “sure thing, take what you want and we won’t try anything to stop you because we’re afraid of you,” Putin would have been less violent. Although I actually don’t think he would have, because the Ukrainians probably still would have mounted armed resistance.

   We’ve discussed the difference between your evaluation of Putin’s aims and my evaluation of those aims, so no need to go over that again at the moment.

   We probably agree, however, on the fact that Biden’s weakness and his energy policy emboldened Putin to attack Ukraine NOW.

6. It’s too bad McCain isn’t alive for his apology. He once said that the only thing he saw when he looked in Putin’s eyes was three letters: K G B. He was right.

7. When I look at the debate footage it seems very much like a prepared line from Obama. I’d bet $100 that it was scripted for him in advance and he was told to work it in if possible. When you watch how Obama delivers it and right after Obama seems a bit directionless, unsure what to say next. It does not appear off the cuff at all.

   And it is a good line. We all remember it.

8. A personal view from Poland; how Poles are responding. They remember. Poland is not a rich country either.

   https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CGzFbzZI2TU

   The Eastern European prospective. Vlad’s paranoia and despotism has a human cost Geoffrey.

9. It turns out to be a good thing that the news media providing us a view into the situation is able to find so many local people who speak English. They don’t have to rely on translators, who may be unavailable, inaccurate, or have their own agenda. And that some of these people can and do go on line to provide a “straight scoop”, per om’s example above. A great many more eyes and ears allowed to see and hear what is happening – unusual until recently with cell phones, etc. Still requires skepticism in what we view, but beneficial overall.

   If we were to allow Russian news people free rein here to interview people [and I suspect that we do, but … ], they would find very few who can speak Russian or Ukrainian, by comparison. [setting aside the Russian media being so controlled to maintain a pro-Russian message.]

10. Rufus T. Firefly:

    I remembered that line of Obama’s, all right. But in my case, I remembered it not only because it seemed planned in advance, but because it was puerile and snarky and sounded like something from “Wayne’s World”.

11. Obama’s snarky reply was “the 1970s called they want their foreign policy back”.

12. BrooklynBoy:

    The quote is not what you say it is, although close. It is this:

13. The problem with Romney‘s campaign amongst many others was that like George W. Bush he was a punching bag and would never fight back. The first debate which was October 3, 2012 he turned in a magnificent performance. He seemed calm, intelligent, well spoken, and presidential. Chris Matthews of MSNBC was apoplectic about how out debated Obama was. The next debate was the presidential debate and the talking head Paul Ryan allowed Joe Biden to just ridicule him while Eraser Head Ryan droned on about “Dodd Frank“. The next debate that Romney and Obama had, Obama had Candy Crowley run interference for him.

14. Neo
    Yes, I made a typo and forgot to proof read.

15. BrooklynBoy:

    I don’t know whether you were reading this blog yet when that 2012 debate happened where Candy Crowley intervened to help Obama. But you might be interested in my take on it at the time, here and here.

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