More thoughts
Ordinarily I’d write “more post-election thoughts,” but the election’s still going on. It will go on for a while.
But my stomach doesn’t feel good about the final outcome. It didn’t feel good last night, either, even when Trump was winning. I knew the left had a lot more up its sleeve.
So today I’m not going to do what some blogs do – give a state-by-state rundown, with counts and possibilities. Everything is in flux right now, with the outcome unknown but trending in the wrong direction. I know that Trump won’t give up without an enormous fight, and he could win that fight, but I’m not optimistic about either his chances or the increased hatred and multiple coup attempts if he were to win.
And speaking of unknowns – if Biden/Harris do win, it’s not the least bit certain how long Biden would last in the top position.
It’s not even so clear that such a switch would matter much, either, except to those who care about having a First Woman President (I’m not one of those people; identity politics is of zero importance to me). It would be fitting and almost humorous (bitterly humorous, but humorous nonetheless) if the first female president were to be someone who was not elected to that office as well as being deeply unpopular – so unable to get votes on her own that she dropped out of her party’s primaries early, and who was chosen solely for her leftism, race, and sex.
I hope the Senate stays in GOP hands. That won’t help the foreign policy and executive order problems inherent in a leftist administration, but it would help a lot of other things.
It’s hard to be optimistic, but I’m trying.
[ADDENDUM: I want to add that, based on what we know so far, the cheating seems obvious and egregious.
However, what will the solid evidence actually show (evidence that would hold up in court, that is)? And what will the courts will ultimately say? That, I can’t predict.
The plan of the Democrats was always to claim victory even if they were behind Election Night, and then to “find” enough votes to win or at least to win in court. The plan for Trump was to claim victory when ahead on Election Night, and then to challenge the “found” votes in court.
That is always what I thought was mostly likely to happen. The part I didn’t know and still don’t know is how good the evidence of fraud will be, what the courts will say, how long it will take to decide, what the immediate reaction of the country will be until then, and how the ultimate loser’s constituents will react.
The entire thing is fraught with peril.
I’ve also just put up a new post on voter fraud.]
I never expected to live in a Banana Republic. Alas.
If there is a will, a sophisticated society should be able to design an election that is honest and transparent, pandemic or no. It was done during multiple wars–at least I think it was.
I share your apprehension regardless of the final outcome, Neo. Chaos in one form or another is assured.
One positive if Trump pulls it out. There is still hope that the instigators of the Coup attempt will eventually be brought to justice.
During the night I was struggling with how to deal with my Trump hating family. I suppose I will work it out; I love them, even though I am disgusted with them at present. Of course, since they live in California, their votes had no real impact. Their attitudes do.
That brings up another point. If the census had not been delayed for seven months, would re-apportionment of electors have occurred by now? California and New York have lost significant population to Red States, but retain their obscene number of electors.
The sad truth that the margin of fraud wasn’t covered this time. With the way the deck is stacked in modern times any conservative/republican candidate has to win decisively by at least several precentage points or the election will be effectively stolen through various means like magically discovering large quantities of votes for the (D) candidate, or invalidating a bunch of votes for the (R) candidate through things like oopsies with sharpies or whatever.
Our election system is now just slightly corrupt. That is, we’re not really near a banana republic level of election corruption, but we are slighly corrupt at the fringes. Our elections are just corrupt enough that amoral, power hungry people can put their thumbs on the scale just a bit when it’s close. It’s a sad state of affairs.
As to the future, I forsee more division within our country on all levels. The best case scenario may be gridlock, with a hypothetical President Harris not really able to get anything accomplished since she won’t really have a sort of “mandate of the people” I guess.
“…how long Biden would last…”
He doesn’t have to last at all, really. Maybe just enough to satisfy those “optics” that the Obama brand seems to find so important.
As for “the succession”, I wonder if they’re going to find a way to somehow shoehorn Hillary in there somewhere. (The King—of corruption—has passed. Long live the Queen…of corruption.)
– – – – – – – – –
“…just slightly corrupt…”
Rather, “…just as corrupt as it has to be…” (The Democrats sorely miscalculated in 2016 and appeared to have learned their lesson well, as it were.)
To be sure, when it comes to corruption, Clinton and Biden do seem to enjoy gilding the lily. As does Obama when it comes to lawlessness.
– – – – – – – – –
Banana republic? As in so many things it depends on how one defines it. However, there are definitely some leading indicators….
Having said all this, it ain’t over till it’s over. On the other hand, one may be excused to be worried that if/when Trump demands a recount, that the Democrats’ antifa/BLM shock troops (together with the ignominious Mainstream Corrupt Media) primed and ready, will be unleashed; and who knows if the military will see fit to step in once the chaos gets out of hand.
But we’re not there yet and let’s hope such a scenario is merely a figment of my sordid imagination.
Thank you Neo for your posts. We commiserate together while we choose to hope and resist despair. I can relate to how you describe your feelings. I pray a lot and and with my husband have prayed for our country for years and of course stepped things up quite a bit since the beginning of the year. I have felt great disappointment in the tacit approval many of my fellow brethren have offered the party that abhors principles that our fundamental to our faith. Truly grievous. Oldflyer your love for your family will carry the day as we are promised that love never fails. But I understand your dilemma. One particular thing I rejoice in today is that my husband and I have raised 3 children (ages 31-39) who all married spouses that embrace the same moral code and political understanding that we have and received from our parents. A true grace for which I am very thankful.
Biden is going to declare he won this afternoon. If Trump does not concede immediately thereafter, antifa will unleash hell on the country.
I disagree with Neo here. The cheating in MI and WI is so obvious that it won’t stand.
The other thing to appreciate is that Trump has litigated all his life. He and the RNC will have top lawyers and law firms working this. They’ve already filed suit to stop the things in MI. The facts and law are on Trump’s side.
I’m more than disgusted with how we haven’t stopped this election cheating in 2020. The Dems planned this all along. They are experts at cheating.
Cornhead:
We don’t disagree as much as you might think. I agree that, based on what we know so far, the cheating seems obvious and egregious. So we agree on that.
Where we disagree – and not strongly, since I simply can’t predict what will happen – is what the solid evidence will actually show (evidence that would hold up in court, that is) and what the courts will ultimately say.
The plan of the Democrats was always to claim victory even if they were behind Election Night, and then to “find” enough votes to win or at least to win in court. The plan for Trump was to claim victory when ahead on Election Night, and then to challenge the “found” votes in court.
That is always what I thought was mostly likely to happen. The part I don’t know is how good the evidence of fraud will be, and what the courts will say, and how long it will take, and how the ultimate loser’s constituents will react.
The entire thing is fraught with peril.
I’ve also just put up a new post on voter fraud, featuring a quote from you.
The dems might not have cheated enough in Arizona – yet.
Instead of 98% counted its more like 86% counted. And it looks like the biggest number are from pro-Trump areas. So it might just flip back from blue to Red.
Wisconsin, however, does seem safely blue by ~20,000 votes 🙁
Nonapod, slightly corrupt? Is that like being slightly pregnant? Well, of course these days pregnancy might be temporary. One could wish that election fraud were.
I don’t know at what point you define slightly corrupt elections as crossing the threshold into Banana Republic territory. I presume that in a BR, the level of fraud would depend on how much is required to get the desired outcome. Oh.
I do know what it feels like to me when this election follows the totalitarian power grabs that occurred under cover of emergency powers justified by the pandemic.
Antifa/BLM are going to riot (aka peacefully protest) no matter what Biden or Trump does or says. That is baked into their cake. All must be burned down in their world view, for “justice.”
It appears that Portland kept the Wheeler, better a dolt than a commie? Oregonians also voted to legalize “small quantities” of heroin, meth, cocaine, fentanyl(?). What could conceivably go wrong with that libertarian approach? Junkies, anarchists, and racists enabled/encouraged. Cue “Lions, Tigers, and Bears, Oh My!”
I am more in Neo’s camp on this- I don’t think Trump is going to win this. I don’t doubt there was some fraud going on late last night once the Democrats figured out how many votes they needed- I think that the point of the delay in counting- to get the plan moving. I just think it is the sort of fraud you won’t ever be able to prove- the bases will have been covered effectively- the Democrats are old hands at this.
Trump’s only real path here is hold onto PA, GA, and NC- all three will be under a relentless onslaught of attempted fraud and delays if the fraud fails. Then pull out either AZ or NV. Arizona is possible- the math does work there, though having been through this exact same thing in the McSally/Sinema Senate race in 2018, I am not terribly optimistic about pulling it out. Nevada is also possible- there are definitely going to be enough ballots to turn that 8K deficit, but they will be late mail vote, and likely to favor Biden, not Trump. If I were the Trump staff, I would combing Nevada for Republicans who didn’t cast their mail ballot- you know the Dems are doing this right now.
I think the margin in PA will hold up, but the Democrats are relentless- it is their special power. They don’t want it to come down to Arizona or Georgia- both states are Republican controlled- they will want to be able to certify the votes for Biden in WI, MI, and PA- it is the best way to avoid losing or not getting a majority of the electoral vote and having the election thrown to the House.
Also, the new House will almost surely have net Republican control if the Presidential election does end up there when neither candidate gets a majority. And if that does happen, the new president might be neither Trump or Biden- the electors for both candidates may get together and vote for two other (or more) candidates at the electoral college so the House can consider the top three electoral vote getters.
Still, though, even for this to happen, Trump needs to hold PA, GA, and NC. He really needs for the marginal state to have a Republican governor and legislature that is willing to fight if the vote itself is even a little bit funky. The most likely scenario of this happening is for AZ or GA to be the state Biden needs- not PA, NC, or NV.
One thing I noticed about PA when I looked at it about an hour ago- very many of the deeply red counties appear to be holding back on a great deal of their vote totals. Almost as if they don’t want to give Philadephia, Allegheny, and Montgomery Counties a target to aim at just yet.
I am always reminded of the probably apocryphal story about the 1960 election where Illinois came down to Cook County vs some other geographical entity of Illinois- both held back their vote totals as long as they could that night until the Republican entity declared their vote and put Nixon in the lead. According to the story, someone in the media room watching this happen jumped up and exclaimed, “Dailey’s got them now! He gets to count last, it is over.”
“I know that Trump won’t give up without an enormous fight …”
Far be it from me to stand against your intuition. But it’s worth noting that
1) The Senate vote had a good outcome (even Collins won, I don’t think James has conceded)
2) The House vote had a good outcome, several key wins not a single loss of incumbent or open seat so far (from an article I read which may be out of date, but still)
So, if Trump could win … even by the skin of his teeth, it would be a full victory.
Even if Biden wins (and as I post this it looks like he might) I will always remember what Trump has accomplished!
On the international front he was taken on China, moved the US embassy to Jerusalem, moved closer to peace in the Middle East, rescued Americans taken hostage abroad, etc.
On the domestic side he got a good judge on the supreme court. He undid much of the federal government’s red tape.
On a personal note, his policies did have an economic benefit for me. After 8 long years of Obamanation on the job front (only temp work when I could get it) I landed a full time job with great benefits (That the company is embracing critical race theory is another issue – I am sort of learning to live with by keeping my head low and waiting for retirement); and, most important of all, I was able to buy a house! I call it my “Trump House.” yea!
With Biden in, I think many are going to wish for Trump’s policies to come back. I just hope that we do not go back to the Obamanation economy.
JimNorCal:
I thought Collins had a chance. She’s savvy about her state, and I think her “no” on the ACB vote – which didn’t hurt ACB one little bit, because McConnell and Collins knew they had the majority without Collins – helped her win in Maine. I explained here. But I certainly wasn’t sure that she would win, and I’m very very glad she did. She helps with the majority, and she usually votes with the GOP, too. Those who turn on her don’t understand, I think, that she would be replaced by a Democrat if she didn’t do what she does.
Holding the Senate may be the only thing that keeps us from full-on leftism. That and SCOTUS.
Neo:
I find Mainers abhorrent in that Collin’s vote against Barrett’s confirmation might have helped her re-election. What do these anti-Barrett people want? More wise obese ideological Latinas on the court? Look at her 55-43 Senate vote for the Appeals seat, merely one rung below SCOTUS, in 2017, just 3 years ago. Did the Dems investigate her Appeals decisions? Not hardly.
What happened in the interval?
The collectivist Dems got more ugly, more vicious, and brayed their ignorance. Hirono from Hawaii was really choice in asking Barrett if she’d ever sexually abused anyone; this fat Jap’s family returned from Hawaii to Japan in 1941, well before Dec. 7, so they liked the idea of Imperial Japan.
I got a lot of text msgs urging contributions to Collins to “save the Senate”. Nope!
Collins is a RINO at best. Can’t count on her to do the next right thing. But look who Maine Dems put up against her!
Maine is not Maine any more.
One thing I noticed about PA when I looked at it about an hour ago- very many of the deeply red counties appear to be holding back on a great deal of their vote totals. Almost as if they don’t want to give Philadephia, Allegheny, and Montgomery Counties a target to aim at just yet. — Yancey Ward
I was wondering about that. It a bit like Lucy Van Pelt holding the football for Charlie Brown. Eventually he’s got to learn not to the play the sucker.
So it is just another coup attempt and we know the President will fight it…and that is about all we know. But what a mensch! @Neo I noticed my copy of the Churchill biography, The Last Lion, on my bookshelf this morning and thought of you and that Churchill was not the last lion – nor will Trump be. The necessity for courage springs eternally in our individual and collective lives because, as Solzenitzen put it. “The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either — but right through every human heart — and through all human hearts. This line shifts. Inside us, it oscillates with the years. And even within hearts overwhelmed by evil, one small bridgehead of good is retained”
@Lorenz Gude:
Final paragraph of the Bridge of San Luis Rey. Resonates a bit.
Still, I might need 10 years in the Gulag to teach me human charity toward Pozzed Progs. Then again we might get just that 😛
Thanks @Zaphod I Read Bridge of San Luis Rey as a teenager but will have to refresh my memory of the final paragraph. So some Pozzed Prog in Philly is filling out mail in ballots for Biden even as we speak, but maybe 10 years from now, with the benefit of hindsight, will find that ‘bridgehead of good ‘in their heart and shake their head in wonder at themselves and the human condition. While I agree they are determined to award a ‘tenner’ to the likes of thee and me, I think the absurdity of their position is far more advanced than in the early 20th century when the totalitarians got total control in Germany or Russia, or China for that matter. “The Narrative” is already in pieces on the ground along with Hunter’s laptop and All the King’s Horses and All the King’s Men…etc. Still History only rhymes and this time around they have the most exquisite surveillance tools ever invented – including a permanent record of this comment thread. You never know who you will meet in the Gulag but, in any case, I am determined to enjoy it.
More and more thoughts – there will be thoughts until the end of time.
Doc Zero has enough thoughts to go around for everyone to have the ones they like best.
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1323975731135893507.html
Something else to think about.
https://notthebee.com/article/trump-the-white-supremacist-just-got-the-biggest-minority-republican-vote-since-1960
It’s official: Trump is the worst white supremacist EVER.
https://notthebee.com/article/alleged-neo-nazi-trump-does-better-in-2020-with-every-race-and-gender-combo-except-white-men
I strongly suspect Twitter and Facebook and Google are not slapping “warning” labels on The Daily Show.
https://notthebee.com/article/florida-goes-for-trump-daily-show-jokingly-suggests-blowing-up-the-entire-state
Nope. They have to save them for the Republicans. There are only so many warning labels in the universe, you know.
https://notthebee.com/article/twitter-is-out-here-just-blocking-everything-trump-tweets
@Zaphod…again. Found a PDF of Wilder’s “The Bridge of San Luis Rey” and, oh yes, it resonates. So thank you. Here is the last bit of the last paragraph for the rest of you.
“But soon we shall die and all memory of those five will have left the earth, and we ourselves shall be loved for awhile and forgotten. But the love will have been
enough; all those impulses of love return to the love that made them. Even memory is not necessary for love. There is a land of the living and a land of the dead and the bridge is love, the only survival, the only meaning.”
There is a 2020 metaphor in this story somewhere….
https://notthebee.com/article/man-delicately-releases-mouse-into-the-wild-hawk-promptly-snatches-it
But then I watched this and cheered up again.
https://notthebee.com/article/trumps-talking-points-showing-up-in-hilarious-network-ssids-and-passwords
“…obvious and egregious…”
Already, one whistle blower—a Michigan postal worker—with pangs of conscience, has spoken up bravely (considering that he’s placed himself in the crosshairs of a certain political party that will not be amused by such—genuine—remorse and integrity):
https://twitter.com/jamesokeefeiii/status/1324174186366074880
It’s a start. Let’s hope there will be other brave souls whose consciences have been rattled.
Perhaps the most amazing thing is that the Democrats believe that EVERYONE has the same values as they do.
(Though perhaps even more amazing is that they might be—mostly—right? In which case….)