Home » What should SCOTUS rule on the subsidies?

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What <i>should</i> SCOTUS rule on the subsidies? — 25 Comments

  1. When Roberts decided the individual mandate was a tax, he had to ignore the meaning of the language imposing the mandate. I see no reason he will differ when this comes to SCOTUS.

  2. I think there is little true doubt about what Congress intended- they intended to use the subsidies as a political club to beat recalcitrant Republicans into submission at the state level, so the DC decision today is the correct one legally. Like Neo, however, I am doubtful that the Roberts court will reach the correct legal decision, and will, instead, come with the decision that provides the least amount of discord given the facts on the ground, but I could be wrong.

    I will also say this- I would hire a lot of security if I were a conservative justice and the court agrees to hear the case- the nuts on the Left are freaking scary these days.

  3. The ACA wasn’t really implemented when Roberts made his first infamous ruling. Now that the data is coming in, Obamacare is being shown as a fraud from top to bottom.
    Roberts, of course, also has taken a huge amount of shit for his original ruling.
    If he wants to redeem himself, this would seem a grand opportunity.

  4. I found the statement that the IRS could “deviate from absurd laws” rather shocking, if not surprising. Does that make sense?

    I don’t suppose that I can deviate from absurd laws. I presume that is because I am not deemed to have the discriminatory skills of an IRS bureaucrat.

    Life in this country is just getting too weird. The people who make the laws are never subject to them. The people who enforce them are seemingly empowered to decide which they will to enforce, and which they do not. The Judges and Justices who adjudicate them decide that the laws, and the Constitution itself, only mean what they would like for them to mean.

    All the while, the population seems to be sleeping–or at the beach. All of those people I cited in the paragraph above better hope they don’t begin to take notice.

  5. Roberts is going to decide based upon the President’s poll numbers.

    If they go into the tank next year 0-care may be shot up by Roberts.

    If the President holds up then I expect Roberts to take the populist way out.

    If the Senate flips to the GOP, expect no end of additional investigations into the rest of the IRS, VA, etc.

    Barry will no longer be able to run the board with Federal judges.

  6. There’s another possibility. John Roberts clearly did something tricky and strange when he ruled that the Obamacare penalties were a tax and not a penalty.

    By calling them a tax he synthesized the conditions under which the plaintiffs in these cases could obtain standing. They would be subject to a tax because the subsidies were improperly made available in their states and how the issue is whether the subsidies can stand. I’m wondering if Roberts was playing a deeper game. He could have struck down the individual mandate, but because of the way he ruled, he now is in a position to potentially strike down the subsidies themselves. I’m going to reserve judgement on Roberts until this plays out. He may have let a small fish go by to get to a much bigger fish.

  7. That is to say, had he struck down the individual mandate, no one would have had standing to challenge the subsidies.

  8. Circuit Court en banc (=entire Court) is heavily Democratic, so en banc outcomes are known until its majority dies of old age decades from now. Just more erosion of the Rule of Law. Get used to it.

  9. The “judges” = Roberts. He is the traitor who took away our protection of the Constitution. Like every guilty traitor, his perfidy necessarily must increase as the he is boxed into his own corner. May he rot in hell.

    The liberal Justices we already know are the enemies of America, and of anything good and decent.

    Roberts is worse than them.

  10. As a matter of law and statutory construction, the DC Circuit is correct and the 4th Circuit is wrong. It is not even a close question.

    If John Roberts is the umpire he claims he is, he will ignore the fact that the ACA law has been in effect for some months. After all, we are only talking about tax subsidies.

  11. And in many states, the governors didn’t want to create a health exchange because of the IT problems and cost. Good decision. Ask Oregon.

  12. And I will predict right now the Supreme Court will grant cert in the 4th Circuit case and reverse it before Christmas.

  13. @blert

    “Roberts is going to decide based upon the President’s poll numbers.”
    Do you think Roberts cares that much about Obama’s popularity? As what, a proxy for public sentiment about the law?
    What mindset would lead Roberts to base his ruling on Obama’s poll numbers?

    @jms

    I’ve heard the “playing 3D chess” explanation before, and it doesn’t hold water. Roberts’ original ruling, by allowing the government to compel citizens to buy products they didn’t want, did lasting damage to the Constitution and the relationship between citizen and state.
    There is no “long game” that justifies that.

  14. @Cornhead

    It would be awesome if SCOTUS pre-empted the en banc hearing of the D.C. court in order to reverse the 4th circuit’s decision.

    Double bitch-slap for Obama.

  15. “And I will predict right now the Supreme Court will grant cert in the 4th Circuit case and reverse it before Christmas.”

    I don’t see any reason to think that’s true.
    Why do you predict this?

  16. In law school I took a class called Supreme Court Seminar and the teacher was 8th Circuit Judge Donald P. Lay.

    While it is usually preferred that a case be “ripe” and that there is a split in the Circuits, there is no rule requiring it. You only need four votes and this is an extremely important case.

    I also hold to the quaint notion that (for the most part) federal judges aren’t political hacks with life tenure. As a pure legal question, the DC Circuit majority is correct. Very smart legal analysis on Powerlineblog by excellent lawyers for more commentary.

  17. The underlying issue is not the construction of a certain phrase but the propriety of the passage of the initial legislation. The nation did not want this law and it had to be passed with lies and confusion.

    It might little matter what is decided; in fact, an injunction against subsidies for federal exchanges may help the law since the fearful and grasping constitute a more active voice than the majority, which may be a slim majority when it comes time to really repeal Obamacare. Their “suffering” will be trumpeted and quantified while the suffering of the “middle class” will, as usual, be absorbed as another cut or blow to the beast of burden.

  18. On the other hand, just for clarification of the state of our judicial corruption, is there any better test? The plain language of the statute and the intent of the legislation are without dispute. Any justice dissenting from the required injunction reveals his or her lack of quality as a judge. They may be something; they are not a judge; their whole life and oath of office is a travesty.

  19. Matt…

    I regard Roberts as being coerced by Barry.

    Indeed, the IRS, NSA, FBI on down the line are running herd/ heard on the Congress.

    Just ask Feinstein.

    At the level of the USSC, the ‘law’ turns on politics.

    And… obviously, Roberts would be the sitting judge should the imperious Wan ever be impeached.

    Everything about 0-care is politics — and shaping the polity.

    &&&

    I find it rather remarkable that Barry is disestablishing the liberal Democratic party of LBJ, JFK, et. al. — and no-one is outraged at the injuries.

    At some point, Barry will have triggered a macro-default on the liberal vision.

    He’s Cloward-Piven’d the Democrat party!

    The inevitable implosion of the gibsmedats league will make ‘Whigs’ out of Democrats.

    Without the constant stream of gibs — their polling calculus implodes.

    Not surprisingly, this grand strategy is enabled by a clown who is actively anti-numeric. The Wan can’t stand numbers, budgets,… limits.

    This angst is based in his upbringing. It’s beyond argumentation. It’s of his soul.

    His rage against momma has no limit. ( In Barry’s case, it’s a rage against his grandmother. Believe me, she’s no angel.)

  20. I don’t have an answer to Neo’s question, but I’d like to note that “The Federalist” web site has a useful post arguing against the Democrats’ contention that the ruling by the D.C. Court of Appeals was an absurd interpretation of a single drafting error. This morning’s propaganda on NPR has adopted the “drafting error” slant, so I suppose it will become the standard mainstream media response to the D.C. court ruling.

    For anybody wh’s interested, here’s a link to the piece at “The Federalist” :
    http://thefederalist.com/2014/07/23/no-halbig-did-not-gut-obamacare-because-of-a-drafting-error/

  21. MSNBC had a guy saying it was a “typo.”

    What a joke.

    The Left will say anything to win.

    I highly recommend Powerlineblog.com for sharp analysis.

    If Congress wanted to include the federal exchange, it could have used those exact words. The IRS people that wrote the regulation was elected by anybody.

  22. To answer the original question of “What should SCOTUS rule on the subsidies,” both the text and intent were clear.
    The text in question (drawing on Powerline’s analysis) was repeated in several places, so it cannot be a “typo.”
    My understanding is that the court is prohibited (wisely) from soliciting post-facto statements of intent from legislators. When returning to contemporaneous statements/reportage on the subject, it seems clear that the intent matches the text.

    The law was written exactly the way it was intended. If that intent was flawed, that’s not the court’s problem. If the court tries to fix the language, it will then have stepped into the realm of legislating.

    SCOTUS should find that federal exchange subsidies are not authorized under the ACA.

  23. I would think that there is a good chance this ends up in the Supreme Court. As stated above, a conflict of circuits is not necessary for cert. Besides, presumably the same issue will work its way through a more conservative circuit at some point.

    Assuming it gets to the Supreme Court when there is the same alignment, I am not so sure that Roberts upholds the subsidy just because he upheld Obamacare. Really different issues. The latter was a constitutional issue; the subsidy issue involves the interpretation of a statute. Why can’t Roberts say-I upheld the law as not violating the commerce clause, and I now uphold it the way that is clearly written and not the way that the IRS interprets it.

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