Take your vitamins!
Oh, never mind.
And in completely unrelated news, this feat is astounding, especially to us non-runners. I’m glad it worked out well; seems potentially risky, though. I wouldn’t recommend it for most people. But then, most people wouldn’t try to do it in the first place.
For anyone curious– the catch is that they only asked about vitamins three times in 20+ years.
The race could be risky, generically speaking, but it seems it’s in her usual range of activities, she kept hydrated and checked with her doctor. Really good article, honestly, it even points out that the risk comes from CHANGING, not from the exercise itself. (In low-risk pregnancies, that is– the only things I can think of that would make it dangerous to continue would all mean it wasn’t a low risk pregnancy.)
Mind you, this is for older women. I personally have to take iron supplements for the rest of my life due to surgery. And I still have to get vitamin level check every 6 months.
This sort of headline usually prompts the great James Taranto to ask, “Above 100%?”
That baby definitely should be a basket case.
This study is pure crap. Unfortunately, the medical, pharmaceutical, industrial complex wants to discourage low-priced supplements as a path to better health. They want all health products to be controlled by their gate keepers.
Anyone who has done any research into vitamin-mineral supplementation knows that there are some things that can be overdosed on. and care should be taken when taking copper, zinc, magnesium, chromium, etc. B & C vitamins, because they are water soluble will never be a problem. They may be a waste of money however. There is some new research about vitamins and minerals that could be used to good effect by the health care industry, but probably won’t because of their belief that, if it can’t be patented, it won’t do their business model any good.
My wife’s doctor, who doesn’t take Medicare and is a bit of a maverick, tests her patients for vitamin and mineral deficiencies. My wife’s supplement regimen is based on those tests. It is working well for her. As a result I have been tested and now am following a personalized regime as well. The tests are expensive – about $350 and must be done twice a year. The supplements cost about $1.50/day. So, this is not something that people with little money or inclination to follow a protocol would want to follow. However, if enough research was done to show it was good protocol, with greater numbers having the tests and buying the supplements, the costs would come down. If it became standard procedure for preventative health care it might save a lot of money over time. But that avenue has never been, and will probably never be, explored. For the reasons mentioned before.
Whether having optimum levels of the required vitamins and minerals in our diets will lead to better health is unproven. The theory, however, is attractive because we know that we get those things from the food we eat and the liquids we drink. There is concern about all the processed foods we eat not having enough of these nutrients. Also, as we age, our bodies seem to become less capable of digesting the needed nutrients from our food. There is pretty good evidence that adult onset diabetes is dietary in nature. It is claimed we can do wonderful things to improve our health through proper diet. And what is proper diet but a diet that ensures we get adequate amounts of the vitamins/minerals required for health? Along with the proper ratios of fats, carbohydrates, and protein we should be able to maintain ourselves in a pretty healthy state. And yet, nutrition is one of the least examined and least championed of our health care tools.
From the Health Department: Living is dangerous to your health. Let’s us take care of that problem for you.
Knowledgeable folks are beginning to point out that a very high percentage of published studies turn out to be wrong. One medical journal published an article estimating more than half are wrong. Venture capitalists find that they are unable to replicate results of groundbreaking studies published in the top journals at a rate somewhere between half to 2/3 of the time — and these are academics who expect their work to be checked. The vast majority of studies are never checked — no audits, no replications. There’s no grant money for it.
Soooo — if more than half is bad work when they know it will be checked, how bad is the work that no one ever expects to be checked?
Every time my wife repeats some finding she hears on tv or reads in the paper, I remind her, “there’s always a chance that these findings may actually turn out to be right.”
@J.J. formerly Jimmy J. This study is pure crap. Unfortunately, the medical, pharmaceutical, industrial complex wants to discourage low-priced supplements as a path to better health. They want all health products to be controlled by their gate keepers.
I have not, as yet, read the contents of the study, but one thing people with such a political view of things overlook is the possibility that there is no pharmaceutical industrial complex… there is just companies, businesses, people doing the same thing you do every day,and laws which mold and structure their thinking as to what they can or cant do – and a state capitalism system that creates those things and force compliance through various carrot and stick applications of things not ever intended nor given permission to do such with.
the increase of death does make sense if you are aware of some pretty basic things we generally dont think about.
the first is that we do not generally live anywhere near the kind of level our historical peers did. ie, very few of them were not having problems with vitamins. rickets and all kinds of conditions no one talks about today, but did when i was a child and still had cases, were from this truth as to vitamins, knowledge and availability
so the normal state of humans is to be unbalanced in vitamins, and generally not healthy food all their lives… (and junk food being healthier than common fair a lot of the time in the past). they went through good times and bad times, and until the industrial revolution and modern life, were quite short for it.
these peoples (in america i referr to mostly but in other places as well as they adopted similar ideas and means), had a lower incidence of cancer, but also had lower incidence of exposure to ‘new’ chemicals and materials…
compared to the era before such basic vitamins followed by nutrition food available to provide it, and after its so different.
when i was a kid the fantasy bs they gave was they could put all nutrition in a pill. that in the future, you could take a few pills and not have to waste time at meals.
anyway…. now that we have food and lots of it (and really tons more space given how efficient they are now)… we have much better nutrition…
but we also have much longer lives which in itself causes cancer… cancer patients that die before they get cancer, dont seem like cancer patients in our perception looking back (and so we wonder about why such an increase. heck its not even 100 years of such living quality!!!!)
well, when you live longer, you get cancer more. day old kids dont get much… well, the key here is that in our food culture where food and vitamins and such are available, we have knocked off a cancer killer and disease fighter system.
infections, cancers, parasites… three classes of creatures (among more) that live in you, require food from you, vitamins, and so on.
sickle cell anemia, not good if both parents pass it on… but if one does… it gives protection from malaria as those critters live inside your red blood cells hiding.
so in a population with so much food, so little self control, they not only make themselves fat, but they make their parasites, cancers and infections fat….
food restriction extends life by slowing down the rate in which the cells divide vs time…
with constant food with almost no fasting, cells divide as fast as the system and its relative signals go…
if you get a cancer, that cancer if nasty enough is going to need food.
maybe the amount of time you have left doesnt change, but the quality or other things may change, which is not what they measure.
as much as the world pretends we know, in truth, the researchers and those that work closely with them do realize we dont know anywhere near as much as we should or want to.
the sad little truth about medicine is that its a very polished form of primitive methods scraping the bottom of the bucket and no clear direction in sight… oh, lots of stuff you know has potential, and maybe things can be worked out, but no real knowledge of how it works.
most of our medicines, not all, work because when they threw a wrench in the machine, the hiccup was beneficial…
much of our knowledge of them that sounds so competent now, is actually from working backwards from the wrench to some of the larger signposts and associating, and then making TRENDY statements of passing theorizing (what i refer to as pissing into the well by habit)
we really as a society, do not have real answers about how things work more than tiny fundemental blocks. and a hell of a lot of detailed facts… a huge huge pile of facts…
and facing it all is the fundamental problem with existentialism… the basic facts and such do not lead to a idea of what the forest looks like…
measuring every leaf, every fold, every vein, every cell count, Fibonacci series of rotations, pistils, and on and on…. wont get you to see a continent… not to mention your big blank spots for deserts.
and the reason is something very metaphysical but real. its called EMERGENCE… we do see it and notice it and such, but usually dont realize what it is as often we have a principal memorized around it or a collection of it that allows us to create the emergence in a way that we use and are familiar with.
the filament and a light bulb is more than just those things, its a tiny system. its properties interlock in such a way that the emergence of new properties are just so that we have something that is useful and so stable and familiar we rarely pay much attention to it.
well, the human body, any body, and the environment around it and all that is such a system… in parallel with its reality is a mathematical reality that abstracts it (as math can abstract any reality, real, not real, functional, or not).
each part of that body down to the actual quarks and gluon’s is a computational functional device. it all has properties, and properties interact.. as more of them build on more of them, you get new properties. an atom cant do push-ups but a marine can. why? his whole being and its functional self has ability which atoms dont have which is emergent, and appear from potential.
its real easy to invent these reasons why they are not moving fast enough.
i mean to point out that we have no other something to compare to, and so all you have or anyone has is some expectation (whether real or not) that then tells them what things “should’ be.
and when they arent what they should be, we try to find aha reasons for it. we seldom try to find out any truth, but instead go shopping for reasons that resonate with us.
what speed should they be creating progress in which the industrial complex would disappear (rather than having some opportunists in passing that one then uses to color the whole)…
most people have no idea how hard new drugs are today… given the lack of real understanding from essentialism, and the lack of any way to see ahead to how a system will work or react, and so on (while getting better at it).. hasnt led to the huge increase of output the way we have come to expect from the exceptional and more easily mateirally controlled electronics/information theory industries.
there really is no theory of emergence that is workable… or leads to some engineering application methodology that reveals understanding of new principals on demand.
these systems are very complex, and the worst of it all is that the make up is under a cultural faddish zeitgeist in which the best and brightest that sacrifice whole lives are not permitted to be in the halls, while a lot of affirmative action and all that with state assistance for race, gender, and now orientation, other proxies are used for competency
so maybe they aren’t going as fast as they should… but it sure isn’t because of a huge industrial complex that wants to be beaten by a competitor with an answer while they bet their billions on gaming things as a constant.
right now and for 40 years they have been putting in people who are assumed to be able to do the work and so forth, and who the system lowered standards and such to make it seem they could… (even that wasnt enough in many cases, and the state wants to penalize them)
between the colleges social planning games, the states licenses and such to milk money like you wouldnt believe, the lack of some larger theory to put all the parts into as a functional whole, and so on…
they are in crisis…
and on top of it, if that wasn’t enough, the permutation math of what they are working on is outstripping their ability to work with it.
ie. they are generating data that is so large its impossible to store and work with reasonably…
how do you work with peta peta bytes and match and analyze it in any kind of human based functional time?
1. J.J. formerly Jimmy J. Says:
This study is pure crap. Unfortunately, the medical, pharmaceutical, industrial complex wants to discourage low-priced supplements as a path to better health. They want all health products to be controlled by their gate keepers.
My understanding is that that’s how it works in Germany. Perhaps expat will be along to confirm or refute.
2. Perhaps more relevant to that baby’s future than the marathon is the fact that the mother is married.
Good for her, on both counts.
Yes, yes, I know: I’m a sexist bigot for being interested in her marital status, which Neo’s AP link did not consider worth mentioning.
I read a similar article in the Wall Street Journal. I found both to be poor articles.
Who were the manufacturers of these multivitamins? What were the controls? What were their lifestyles like?
There is a lot of “crap” out on the market. I am 63. I have been taking quite a number of vitamins, herbs and supplements for MANY years. I buy only from quality manufacturers. With some supplements, I have definitive proof (for me) that they work. Others I take . . . I hope they are doing what they are supposed to do. I rarely get sick and can sometimes go years without a cold.
Yup, keep your hands away from your eyes and nose and wash your hands frequently. If someone (even family or friends) has a cold, DO NOT be afraid to take a step back. Do not use a phone if someone has a cold. Or, DO NOT be afraid to wipe the phone down with alcohol before using it. )
I heard a nurse say to my wife (same age), I can’t believe you are not on any medication and never had any surgery. What kind of stupid question is that? How about asking: How do you manage to stay so healthy? You need to understand that big Pharma DOES NOT PROFIT if you stay healthy. And too many doctors have bought in to big Pharma.
Artfldgr,
Your point is well taken about not knowing what the optimum state of health is because it is in a constant state of flux both in the present and over time. I had forgotten about rickets being a concern here in the U.S. when I was a kid.
We have spent a lot on basic medical research – some private and a lot of public money. However, it seems to me that proper nutrition has been overlooked as a health care concern because it’s too expensive to do the research and there’s no obvious profit to be made. The idea of prevention has only recently come to the fore because all our treatment modalities have become so doggone expensive. Suddenly the idea that prevention might be a good idea makes more sense. But the money has to come from somewhere. Calling Bill Gates and Warren Buffett, maybe?
Emergence sounds a lot like “And God said, let there be . . .” Indeed, the succeeding levels of being each are an emergent response to a command, a flood of information, not cumulative accidental mutations. The fact that each emergence builds upon the last emergence provides dual evidence–one for a Creator and one for evolution–escapes the current science. Kind of like in cosmology where science has hidden the fact that it seems the Universe has a center. But, it is just like the infathomable God to so structure reality so that faith should always be faith and not science.
Truth has rights, too.
A couple of years ago there was a story about a woman who died from an overdose of …
water.
So there you have it folks. No vitamins, no water, stick to martinis and margaritas. As W. C. Fields said,”Water? Never touch the stuff. Fish f*ck in it.”
A while back some comic made the comment that you meet the sickliest people in a health food store. Perhaps the people inclined to taking supplements are on average less healthy to begin with.
I think i trust my body telling me what it needs over some study. As a kid i liked to eat things lke roses on a birthday cake i can’t stand anymore. It’s not a concious thing. Your body knows what it needs to ingest. The problem is we don’t always listen to it.
However, it seems to me that proper nutrition has been overlooked as a health care concern because it’s too expensive to do the research and there’s no obvious profit to be made.
this is not true, as supplements and nutrition are one of the LARGEST Economic areas for health products, including a huge section of useless crude… my favorite new one is lychee… well my wife is Chinese, and from Indonesia, and to her lychee are like apples in the US, as are Rambutang, etc…
Nutritional anything barely needs any approval because of the fact its food. show that people eat it as food, you can put it in a jar. that’s why there are so many who put herbal stuff together. the herbs are considered food, even though they are somewhat active.
so many people say stuff and never check it out!
i did a look…
Revenues and Market Shares of the Top Dietary Supplement Manufacturers, 1997
the millions is revenue, and for the top three I give their percentage of market share…
Leiner Health Products (Your Life) 425 Million [7.02%,ms]
Pharmavite (Nature Made) 340 Million [5.62%,ms]
American Home Products/Lederle (Centrum) 325 Million [5.37%,ms]
Rexall Sundown 291 Million
NBTY (Natures Bounty) 281 Million
General Nutrition Companies (GNC) 260 Million
Weider Nutrition Group (Schiff) 219 Million
Twin Laboratories (Nature’s Herbs) 213 Million
Abbott Labs (Ross Products) 170 Million
Perrigo 152 Million
Solgar Vitamin and Herb Company 120 Million
Bayer Corporation (One-a-Day) 110 Million
IVC Industries (International Vitamin Corp.) 109 Million
and there’s no obvious profit to be made.
maybe that’s why your not in the dietary supplements market… its over 25 billion in the US alone..
and that above does not include health clubs, health spas, food nutrition centers, food programs like jennie craig, assorted health exercise machines, and more (including those nice soft pads made for the Pilates fad).
technically everyone protesting on wall street can see no obvious profit anywhere… and so can only see the profit they see already made, but even that isnt a valid image either. so they see nothing but claim to see everything. they are there with nothing not only because of school but because they have not the desire to move their fingers from their play and do a tiny bit of research before they put crap in their heads and believe it.
you want to talk nutrition?
think junk food is bad?
how about shopping for lies and untruths put out there to influence you to someones agenda and turn you into a social acultural robot with a mission like a termite on a quest?
for be it for me to say that there is no such thing as conspiracy, but there is also such a thing as unmanaged expectations and brain food not fit for feeding your gold fish with.
by the way, almost EVERY hospital has a nutrition department… if they feed patients they have a nutritionist on staff to approve and look over menus.
The reason that story of the “conspiracy of capitalism” against the people is out there put there by Marxists is why?
its like endlessly repeating the same thing and watching it go in one ear out the other.. marxists MAKE history, ie, they tell you they do. they tell you they collectively conspire, they tell you they socially engineer and manipulate beings without permission. they also find and say that its critical that we come up with the right lies to mobilize the masses (that’s you).
and what do they want YOU to do in some tiny fractional way, like taking a penny a day from every person in the US… its ONLY a penny, over a year you end up with $1,095,000,000 in pennies…
so what tiny thing do you do for them that you don’t know your doing and expending energy on and so on?
they don’t pay you a penny, but they get labor from you in excess of a penny, and from some whole weeks and days of their lives rather than just a few minutes reinforcing the false message till the big lie is situated really good in the zeitgeist!
When I ran the Marine Corp marathon in D.C. back in the early ’90s, it was noteworthy because a man collapsed and died only a couple of miles short of completing it.
Giving birth immediately after completing one is a much happier outcome.
Ying and yang.
Larry Ellison has donated a significant sum of money to the preventative health “industry” recently. I get Life Extension Mag and some of their supplements (I’m not sure how much of a scam they are…) and there was a big right up on the money a few months ago. As people age, mortality hits home.
There’s an old IT joke – What’s the difference between God and Larry Ellison? God doesn’t think he’s Larry Ellison.
Artfldgr,
You’re right that there are some companies that are turning a tidy profit on supplements. Their supplements are food and are probably mostly safe and surely safer than patented drugs. The problem is that the drugs are prescribed to treat specific problems – infections, assuage pain, reduce cholesterol, quiet inflammation, release nitrogen, etc. Supplements are, at least at this point in time, mostly guess work. My wife’s doctor is trying to be more prescriptive by testing for vitamin and mineral levels and varying the dosages to attempt to achieve optimum levels. The idea being to not take too much of one thing and not enough of another. Her efforts may be not totally correct, but possibly more helpful than just gulping down a big multi-vitamin and some herbs and hoping it’s going to help.
The research necessary to optimize nutrition requires following a large number of people over a long enough period of time and controlling their diets over that period. That would require a lot of money and effort. And in the end, the results might not mean much. It’s never been done and probably won’t be. The government’s attempts at their various food pyramids is an example of how poorly nutrition is understood.
I was part of a study of Naval aviators and heart disease. It ran over forty years. At the end, they discovered that men selected for physical fitness and health at age 20-24 do not develop heart disease at the same rate as the general population over the same time frame. My reaction was, “Well. duh?”
The less than healthy people who patronize supplement stores are people who have not found cures in regular medicine and are searching for that magic elixir. Dr. Dean Edell’s radio show talks a lot about supplements. His family began one of the early supplement companies and his view of it is that it can’t hurt, but is mostly a waste of money. (Most MDs subscribe to this idea,) Sometimes people begin taking a supplement and find relief from the symptoms that have been troubling them. Dr. Edell chalks it up to the placebo effect and calls it anecdotal evidence that can’t be trusted. He’s right, of course, but wouldn’t it be nice if we knew for sure that it was all a waste of money?
I find vitamins to be useful when rebuilding the body after martial arts training. Otherwise, things tend to be slow on that side
The research necessary to optimize nutrition requires following a large number of people over a long enough period of time and controlling their diets over that period. That would require a lot of money and effort. And in the end, the results might not mean much. It’s never been done and probably won’t be. The government’s attempts at their various food pyramids is an example of how poorly nutrition is understood.
yes. and your tax dolalrs have been paying for it.
your just in the dark over it… because of bad expectations management… ie you expect a result from strudies that are perceivable. but if you dont pay attention or know what results come from it, how do you percieve it?
where do you think the freaking nutrition pyramids and such coem from?
i just did a search for you on PubMed..
(look it up)
one word… nutrition
Results: 1 to 20 of 244262
why dont you try to read all of them since they dont do research you can be an expert.
but then dont forget to search this too
enteral nutrition
clinical nutrition
nutrition education
total parenteral nutrition
cancer nutrition
7,169 results for the journal nature alone.
20461 results for JAMA (journal of american medical association)
by the way… if you consider that more papers get written today than early last century… in fact most were from 1900 onwards…
there are thousands and thousands of studies.
Impact of Probiotics on Colonizing Microbiota of the Gut.
Lowering the Risk of Rectal Cancer among Habitual Beer Drinkers by Dietary Means.
Effect of antioxidants on the incidence of wound infection in burn patients.
Folic acid supplements in pregnancy and severe language delay in children.
Vitamin D supplementation for cardiovascular disease prevention.
Impact of fruit and vegetable vouchers and dietary advice on fruit and vegetable intake in a low-income population.
Potential Role of Antioxidant Food Supplements, Preservatives and Colorants in the Pathogenesis of Allergy and Asthma.
Vitamins and Cognition: What is the Evidence?
Water-soluble vitamin homeostasis in fasting northern elephant seals (Mirounga angustirostris) measured by metabolomics analysis and standard methods.
yes.. it goes that far!!!
they study vitamins and nutrition in thousands of animals you never heard of…
just that paper alone has 101 related citations.. that is over 100 papers reference it…
so, are we talking reality here, or fake reality that serves a political purpose as you refuse to change your reality to meet the real one.
ie., the premises you keep voicing are FALSE… there was never a promise they were true… the side spouting it claims there is no such thing as truth and truth is whatever higher power says it is.
THATS A CLUE…
so the premises are not goods on a shelf where you like heinz over something else.. which is how most treat it…
if a premise is wrong, all that stems from it is wrong, (Even if accidently right!).
so, when shopping for premises, dont pick the one you like… pick the one thats right!!!
picking the one you like that fits a narrative you enjoy that is designed tomake you feel better…
is how you end up on the wrong side of maddoffs…
It’s never been done and probably won’t be. The government’s attempts at their various food pyramids is an example of how poorly nutrition is understood.
what your talking about are whats called Lingitudal studies… they are constantly going on and some of them started back in the 1800s…
see: largest longitudinal study
LARGEST LONGITUDINAL STUDY OF CHILDREN’S HEALTH COMES TO MAINE
The National Children’s Study — developed by the National Institutes of Health (NIH) — will examine the effects of environmental influences on the health and development of more than 100,000 children across the United States, following them from before birth until age 21. The ultimate goal of the study is to improve the health and well being of children.
21 years, 100 thousand people…
are you talking reality or are you talking fantasy?
well, you believe reality since you belive the ones talking fantasy.
you NEVER BOTHERED TO EVEN DO A SIMPLE CHECK OF YOUR PREMISES OR FACTS!!!
think of what you said up top.
never been done..
there are hundreds of them!!
why bother to check, you already knew they didnt exist…
i would be VERY pissed at the liars who you believed in!!!!!!!!!! they put garbage in your head, and so GIGO comes true
you spout garbage as truth, because you were given garbage and never cared enough to do your own checking
ie. your in their thrall because you beleive their false facts.
World’s largest ever longitudinal study of households launched
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2008/oct/13/research-highereducation
Researchers will use data obtained from annual questionnaires of 40,000 British households to study issues such as education, health, income earnings, employment, caring responsibilities and satisfaction with life.
all you had to do was type in largest study…
but instead, you went with what?
propaganda
but to you propaganda was truth, the spravka (help) they gave you is not truth. it SERVES the ends of the socialists.. dam i man… they say they are playing you for a fool!!!
you dont descern propaganda by how it feels, that how you swallow it.