I fail to grok Libya. Based upon all that I have read Libya seems to be a surreal society, as strange as Mao’s China, Pol Pot’s Cambodia, or the cuckoo land of NK. Qaddafi is of the same ilk as sociopathic nut jobs like Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, Che, Ho Chi Men, Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Chavez, etc. I would place our supreme narcissist Obama in the same category but fortunately, he’s no longer able to to fool most of the people most of the time and he’s constrained by the checks and balances of our system of government.
Tragically, it seems that crushing the revolt is now a matter of driving the mercenaries from Tripoli to Tobruk.
I wonder what GW Bush would have done?
Bob,
I have no idea of what can be done aside from parking a carrier off shore and enforcing a no fly zone and embargo. And, that might not make any difference in the long run. IMO, this is one of those stand back and watch situations.
The term ‘fog of war’ refers to incomplete knowledge of your opponents status and intentions. It’s important in the effect that it has on your ability to plan and act in the most appropriate and efficient fashion in which to achieve your desired strategic, operational, or tactical goal(s).
I think what you’re seeing in this report is simple anarchy. In fact, at this point I’m not sure either side is really interested in penetrating the intelligence fog, assuming they even suspect its existence. They’re both more interested at the moment in destroying their opponent é outrance in a purely unreflective fashion.
Assuming the military does not succeed in crushing them and this goes on for a while, the leaders in the population may get to the point where they show some interest in penetrating the fog later.
Daffy Duck is going the full Adolf.
He must have seen the parodies using Downfall.
Time Magazine says that Daffy can count on 1 out of 9 men in the Libyan Army — the other 8 have gone over to the opposition.
Further, that Benghazi and east are lost to the Duck. But that’s where the oil is!
All of the brains in the oil patch are fleeing home and shutting down operations.
Again with the Adolf thing: Daffy is commanding self-destruction far and wide.
5,000 men would appear to be too little, too late to regain his throne no matter how crazed they are.
Daffy is down to one tribe — his own — everyone else has bailed.
BTW the muslim brotherhood has put a fatwa on his head. He’s sure to be more paranoid than Caligula or Stalin. That’s right — be packs his own heat.
Let Italy sort this one out. American boys and girls shouldn’t always do the heavy lifting.
For anyone who missed it: Fascinating article by Michael Totten about his trip to Libya, just months after it was opened to Americans for the first time in decades. Great photos, too. I think you’ll especially enjoy the part about the old Berber town: gorgeous.
Gaddafi is a totalitarian Marxist, and his people loathe him.
It is instructive to learn that there is a level of savagery which is much worse than casual barbarity of Islam. Compared to pre-Islamic mentality of tribal warlords of Bedouin tribes, or Kafir chieftains like Mugabe, Islam is, indeed, religion of peace (relatively).
To bring in Sub-Saharian black mercenaries from Chad to kill Arabs or Berbers is, indeed, a suicidal act. The whole patchwork of different Libyan tribes will unite in disgust against Daffi at the face of such betrayal.
Totally unrelated, but it is time for commercial vessels to arm themselves when traveling the shipping lanes anywhere near Somalia, and blow any pirate vessel slam out of the water as soon as it is within range. Enough is enough.
Same goes with the various military vessels plying those waters. Basically, shoot first and ask questions later.
What I want to know is why Obama feels he can weigh in on the situation in Wisconsin but is silent on the chaos in Libya (and elsewhere) post Egypt? Hilary gets to carry the water on international relations. It’s time for the 3 AM phone call, so where is he?
br549,
“…but it is time for commercial vessels to arm themselves…”
That’s taken care of by our old pal International Law. As a global example of gun control, non-military vessels must be unarmed. As a global example of how this system works (to borrow a phrase from Big Sis), it means the vessels of states that abide by this law are at the mercy at those that don’t. Q.E.D. here.
My own sense of it is that Daffi-Duck (as the regulars at Rantburg call him) has essentially screwed the pooch. After 41 years, the ordinary Libyans been pushed to the point where they don’t much care about what happens to them, or what happens afterward – only that he goes. The only thing is will it be a short informal trial and a firing squad (a la Ceausescu of Romania) or an angry mob and hung from the canopy of an urban gas station (Mussolini). Decamping with valuables to a foreign country is out – he’s alienated too many of the close-in potentially welcoming ones, and the other pariah states are too far away.
So – interesting times, in the Chinese curse sense of it, eh? Oh, yeah – and Obama is in so far over his head he has no idea of how far over his head things are. Imagine what he would be saying if he really had the slightest clue.
This old pal should be put to rest. In matters of life and death, if a law is an ass, it should be just ignored. For me natural right of self-defence trumps all legalisms in universe. This, of course, includes preemptive moves when the danger is clear and imminent.
Sergey,
We see eye to eye on this. As did Albert Camus. As does Benny Morris. Theoretical systems must be discarded when the facts on the ground (or at sea, in this case) render them obsolete.
blert et al, I wonder why Hezbollah and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard have not bolstered Gaddafi’s forces. Word is Tripoli has already been terrified into submission. The opportunities for a Iran, Syria, Libya axis seem too good to past up. A few flights bringing their forces from Beirut to Tripoli and the Iranians dominate a very large chuck of the world’s oil. Once established in Libya taking Tunisia is a weekend excursion. The west, particularly the US certainly won’t do anything beyond a harshly worded statement. The Iraqis, Saudis and Gulf would have no choice but to bow and say yes. Then Iran controls world’s economies,something the Soviet Union never came close to.
There is nothing standing in their way, I wonder what is keeping them back?
Bob, Iranian leaders fear green tsunami at streets of Tehran and need now all reliable forces they can muster.
Now THAT would be interesting, Sergey. Could Odumbo turn out to be a genius in the long run… naaaaah.
blert
its not the full adolf its the full stalin..
adolf came later copying them…
oh.. and as i posted, daffy as you called him has hired romanian die, and soviet ex troops, and ukranian and spetznatz… (at very high prices i might add)
so he has some of the most ruthless brutish violent competent soldiers running the streets.
ALL ex SOVIET..
so how is he pulling an adolf?
ah…because you dont know which is which…
and that the distinction between the two is almost nil
oh.
i should also point out that stalin was not paranoid.
they WERE out to get him (and beria eventually did)
Artfldgr
Doing the Adolf — as in bunkering in for his own downfall.
Stalin lived between paranoia and true vision.
The Duck of Death’s mercs are exactly repeating the antics of the SS in April 1945 — and the OOs of the Kremlin on the Eastern Front.
The merc’s have to get the news: dying is no way to make a living.
Daffy should take his lead from Nappy and flee the battlespace.
Really the situation in Libya and Middle East created new financial and crude oil crisis, which in my eyes will be harder than the one happened last year. Terrible, but such dictators should be removed from the governments.
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I fail to grok Libya. Based upon all that I have read Libya seems to be a surreal society, as strange as Mao’s China, Pol Pot’s Cambodia, or the cuckoo land of NK. Qaddafi is of the same ilk as sociopathic nut jobs like Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, Che, Ho Chi Men, Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini, Hitler, Chavez, etc. I would place our supreme narcissist Obama in the same category but fortunately, he’s no longer able to to fool most of the people most of the time and he’s constrained by the checks and balances of our system of government.
Tragically, it seems that crushing the revolt is now a matter of driving the mercenaries from Tripoli to Tobruk.
I wonder what GW Bush would have done?
Bob,
I have no idea of what can be done aside from parking a carrier off shore and enforcing a no fly zone and embargo. And, that might not make any difference in the long run. IMO, this is one of those stand back and watch situations.
The term ‘fog of war’ refers to incomplete knowledge of your opponents status and intentions. It’s important in the effect that it has on your ability to plan and act in the most appropriate and efficient fashion in which to achieve your desired strategic, operational, or tactical goal(s).
I think what you’re seeing in this report is simple anarchy. In fact, at this point I’m not sure either side is really interested in penetrating the intelligence fog, assuming they even suspect its existence. They’re both more interested at the moment in destroying their opponent é outrance in a purely unreflective fashion.
Assuming the military does not succeed in crushing them and this goes on for a while, the leaders in the population may get to the point where they show some interest in penetrating the fog later.
Daffy Duck is going the full Adolf.
He must have seen the parodies using Downfall.
Time Magazine says that Daffy can count on 1 out of 9 men in the Libyan Army — the other 8 have gone over to the opposition.
Further, that Benghazi and east are lost to the Duck. But that’s where the oil is!
All of the brains in the oil patch are fleeing home and shutting down operations.
Again with the Adolf thing: Daffy is commanding self-destruction far and wide.
5,000 men would appear to be too little, too late to regain his throne no matter how crazed they are.
Daffy is down to one tribe — his own — everyone else has bailed.
BTW the muslim brotherhood has put a fatwa on his head. He’s sure to be more paranoid than Caligula or Stalin. That’s right — be packs his own heat.
Let Italy sort this one out. American boys and girls shouldn’t always do the heavy lifting.
For anyone who missed it: Fascinating article by Michael Totten about his trip to Libya, just months after it was opened to Americans for the first time in decades. Great photos, too. I think you’ll especially enjoy the part about the old Berber town: gorgeous.
Gaddafi is a totalitarian Marxist, and his people loathe him.
http://pajamasmedia.com/michaeltotten/2011/02/20/in-the-land-of-the-brother-leader-2/
It is instructive to learn that there is a level of savagery which is much worse than casual barbarity of Islam. Compared to pre-Islamic mentality of tribal warlords of Bedouin tribes, or Kafir chieftains like Mugabe, Islam is, indeed, religion of peace (relatively).
To bring in Sub-Saharian black mercenaries from Chad to kill Arabs or Berbers is, indeed, a suicidal act. The whole patchwork of different Libyan tribes will unite in disgust against Daffi at the face of such betrayal.
Totally unrelated, but it is time for commercial vessels to arm themselves when traveling the shipping lanes anywhere near Somalia, and blow any pirate vessel slam out of the water as soon as it is within range. Enough is enough.
Same goes with the various military vessels plying those waters. Basically, shoot first and ask questions later.
What I want to know is why Obama feels he can weigh in on the situation in Wisconsin but is silent on the chaos in Libya (and elsewhere) post Egypt? Hilary gets to carry the water on international relations. It’s time for the 3 AM phone call, so where is he?
br549,
“…but it is time for commercial vessels to arm themselves…”
That’s taken care of by our old pal International Law. As a global example of gun control, non-military vessels must be unarmed. As a global example of how this system works (to borrow a phrase from Big Sis), it means the vessels of states that abide by this law are at the mercy at those that don’t. Q.E.D. here.
My own sense of it is that Daffi-Duck (as the regulars at Rantburg call him) has essentially screwed the pooch. After 41 years, the ordinary Libyans been pushed to the point where they don’t much care about what happens to them, or what happens afterward – only that he goes. The only thing is will it be a short informal trial and a firing squad (a la Ceausescu of Romania) or an angry mob and hung from the canopy of an urban gas station (Mussolini). Decamping with valuables to a foreign country is out – he’s alienated too many of the close-in potentially welcoming ones, and the other pariah states are too far away.
So – interesting times, in the Chinese curse sense of it, eh? Oh, yeah – and Obama is in so far over his head he has no idea of how far over his head things are. Imagine what he would be saying if he really had the slightest clue.
This old pal should be put to rest. In matters of life and death, if a law is an ass, it should be just ignored. For me natural right of self-defence trumps all legalisms in universe. This, of course, includes preemptive moves when the danger is clear and imminent.
Sergey,
We see eye to eye on this. As did Albert Camus. As does Benny Morris. Theoretical systems must be discarded when the facts on the ground (or at sea, in this case) render them obsolete.
blert et al, I wonder why Hezbollah and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard have not bolstered Gaddafi’s forces. Word is Tripoli has already been terrified into submission. The opportunities for a Iran, Syria, Libya axis seem too good to past up. A few flights bringing their forces from Beirut to Tripoli and the Iranians dominate a very large chuck of the world’s oil. Once established in Libya taking Tunisia is a weekend excursion. The west, particularly the US certainly won’t do anything beyond a harshly worded statement. The Iraqis, Saudis and Gulf would have no choice but to bow and say yes. Then Iran controls world’s economies,something the Soviet Union never came close to.
There is nothing standing in their way, I wonder what is keeping them back?
Bob, Iranian leaders fear green tsunami at streets of Tehran and need now all reliable forces they can muster.
Now THAT would be interesting, Sergey. Could Odumbo turn out to be a genius in the long run… naaaaah.
blert
its not the full adolf its the full stalin..
adolf came later copying them…
oh.. and as i posted, daffy as you called him has hired romanian die, and soviet ex troops, and ukranian and spetznatz… (at very high prices i might add)
so he has some of the most ruthless brutish violent competent soldiers running the streets.
ALL ex SOVIET..
so how is he pulling an adolf?
ah…because you dont know which is which…
and that the distinction between the two is almost nil
oh.
i should also point out that stalin was not paranoid.
they WERE out to get him (and beria eventually did)
Artfldgr
Doing the Adolf — as in bunkering in for his own downfall.
Stalin lived between paranoia and true vision.
The Duck of Death’s mercs are exactly repeating the antics of the SS in April 1945 — and the OOs of the Kremlin on the Eastern Front.
The merc’s have to get the news: dying is no way to make a living.
Daffy should take his lead from Nappy and flee the battlespace.
Really the situation in Libya and Middle East created new financial and crude oil crisis, which in my eyes will be harder than the one happened last year. Terrible, but such dictators should be removed from the governments.