For our own good: liberty and health
Coercion is so tempting when one has the excuse of having good intentions:
CNN medical analyst Dr. Leana Wen warned the Biden administration that it has a very “narrow window” for inoculating as many people as possible to COVID-19 as states begin lifting coronavirus restrictions, urging that messaging should tie vaccinations to Americans’ “freedoms.”
“if everything is reopened, then what’s the carrot going to be? How are we going to incentivize people to actually get the vaccine? So that’s why I think the CDC and the Biden administration needs to come out a lot bolder and say, ‘If you are vaccinated, you can do all these things. Here are all these freedoms that you have.’ Because otherwise, people are going to go out and enjoy these freedoms anyway.”
This sort of statement should surprise no one. The camel of social control by health bureaucrats got its nose in the tent, and now the camel’s entire body is in there and looking to dominate the space. We Americans cannot be trusted to make our own health care decisions, and any amount of COVID virus in the population is a reason for continuing the crackdown and deprivation of liberty. What was initially sold as a very temporary two-week situation has segued into over a year, and even the vaccine won’t be allowed to liberate us until it has more or less eliminated the risk entirely.
Which is unlikely to ever occur – and even if it did, there would always be another virus and another reason to control us.
It’s easy to criticize Dr. Wen by saying “what do you expect; she was born in China, where this sort of coercion for social credit is a commonplace from of social control, and there is no tradition of liberty like ours.” But I think that’s too simplistic. Dr. Wen came here from China in 1991 at the age of eight, when her parents were granted political asylum. So she is mostly a product of our own school system. She grew up in the Los Angeles area, so we’re talking specifically about the California school system. She also raced though her education, getting a college degree in biochemistry at the age of 18:
Attending the Early Entrance Program (EEP) at California State University, Los Angeles starting at age 13, Wen graduated summa cum laude at age 18 with a bachelor’s degree in biochemistry, in 2001. She received a Doctor of Medicine from Washington University School of Medicine and has two master’s degrees, one in Economic and Social History and another in Modern Chinese Studies, both from the Merton College, Oxford in England where she was a Rhodes Scholar.
I’m not sure when she got her basic grounding in what we used to call Civics, but my guess is that it had a very “progressive” slant. I believe that this, more than her country of birth, had the biggest effect on her disregard for liberty. It is something that seems to be shared nowadays by the vast majority of people in charge, whatever their ethnicity and whatever their brainpower.
I keep being reminded of the work of Sarah Conly, which I’ve written about many times (see this, and the links in the first paragraph there). Those who would protect us for our own good are nearly everywhere these days, and much of the public seems to have gotten quite used to it. As C.S. Lewis wrote:
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
[NOTE: And by the way, speaking of robber barons – I haven’t read this book, but it sure sounds interesting:
The Myth of the Robber Barons describes the role of key entrepreneurs in the economic growth of the United States from 1850 to 1910. The entrepreneurs studied are Cornelius Vanderbilt, John D. Rockefeller, James J. Hill, Andrew Mellon, Charles Schwab, and the Scranton family. Most historians argue that these men, and others like them, were Robber Barons. The story, however, is more complicated.
The author, Burton Folsom, divides the entrepreneurs into two groups market entrepreneurs and political entrepreneurs. The market entrepreneurs, such as Hill, Vanderbilt, and Rockefeller, succeeded by producing a quality product at a competitive price. The political entrepreneurs such as Edward Collins in steamships and in railroads the leaders of the Union Pacific Railroad were men who used the power of government to succeed. They tried to gain subsidies, or in some way use government to stop competitors. The market entrepreneurs helped lead to the rise of the U. S. as a major economic power. By 1910, the U. S. dominated the world in oil, steel, and railroads led by Rockefeller, Schwab (and Carnegie), and Hill. The political entrepreneurs, by contrast, were a drain on the taxpayers and a thorn in the side of the market entrepreneurs. Interestingly, the political entrepreneurs often failed without help from government they could not produce competitive products.
More at the link.]
The so called “Robber Baron” also gave back generously to the citizens. They provided for the NY Public Library, perhaps the finest public library in world.
Among various things about Dr. Wen’s statements that bother me is that her words are a disincentive for getting the vaccination.
When the CDC says at any level, getting the vaccination doesn’t mean you can be around others, then the question is why?
1) Is it because the vaccine really doesn’t work? Because if the vaccine works, then there should be absolutely no fear of being around others that are or not vaccinated. You shouldn’t need a mask at all, because your body knows how and will attack the virus.
2) Is it because the vaccine may work, but the CDC is uncertain of the side effects? Because if that’s the case, then why should people be test subjects? Did the CDC learn nothing from their racist past in the Tuskegee experiments? Why would a majority of people sign up for such a vaccination?
3) Is it because despite the vaccine working with few side effects? The CDC still wants to give politicians emergency powers. That’s a great way to get people, who aren’t anti-vaxxers, to support those against vaccination.
However, if the CDC were to be clear; “Get the vaccination and you will be safe to be in public?” Then what other carrot is necessary except for the cases of those that are simply irrationally opposed to vaccination?
Dr. Wen should be fired from her role as a CDC spokesperson.
AGGHHHH! Not another libertarian/Randian effort to portray the Robber Barons are “these really swell guys who did all these wonderful things until stupid government got involved.”
Just watch “The Men Who Made America” from the History Channel.
Mike
Leland I think she was actually trying to argue for an incentives based policy that would restore normalcy and ‘freedoms’ on the condition of vaccination. It seems she was gently criticizing the CDC for undermining incentives to vaccinate.
That’s clearer from later statements in which she’s elaborated on her position. Also she’s not currently a CDC spokesperson, simply someone that’s often consulted on public health policy. I don’t know why the media keeps referring to her as such.
I’d actually love to hear her opinion on the state of public health policy towards COVID more broadly. The thing I’ve noticed about people in public policy who are as candid as she is, is that they tend to be evidence driven – i.e. they will adapt their policy positions in response to new evidence. That may seem counterintuitive, given the policies she’s advocating, but she might surprise you.
This is all about balancing the US with other countries for a one world merger…
Always was… if we lose in a war, it merges… if we economically implode, helps merge… if we invite everyone in too collapse, helps merge… royalty wants its throne back…
I see no problem with incentivizing the vaccine. Back in the day, I could not go to school if I did not have a small-pox scar on my arm. We all had them. If anyone objected, I was either too young, or too busy, to notice. (I can barely find it after 79 years, but, either a tiny scar from the original, or from a booster, is still there.)
It may be a fine line to walk; and I know that officialdom is not adept at walking fine lines these days; but, if there are some restrictions on the use of public facilities for the recalcitrant, so be it.
Love your blog, New Neo. I’m coming over from ALTHOUSE and hope to be a regular commentor on current events and the arts.
Ah Fandor, leaving Ann too.
I told my wife months ago that getting the shot card would be a “Passport” to get into places and travel. But if you still have to mask up and stay 6 ft away, some people are asking WHY get the shot. What a fine mess.
All over the freeway reader boards in the Puget Sound area say:
‘Vaccinated or not please mask up’
NO, NO, NO!!!
This is why the masking will never, ever end in blue states. It has become some kind of warped religious cult at this point.
At my mom’s facility they now say that 97% of staff and residents are fully vaccinated meaning about 2 or 3 people or so have not been vaccinated yet they still have to wear masks and for meals they all sit at a table (big enough for 6 people) all by themselves. It is ridiculous and when asked their answer is always ‘DOH (dept of health) this and CDC that’ blah, blah, blah.
When will it ever go back to normal if not now?
If you plotted out, for individuals, – number of of advanced degrees obtained since 1980 or so – against – number of progressive political stances – you’d get a very high correlation.
The most recent info on death rate for Winnie-the-Flu is 2.3%. About a month ago it was 2.6%. That rate isn’t a big incentive for getting vaccinated.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
The Myth of the Robber Barons: Myth it may have been but if it is contemporaneous, it wasn’t invented decades later.
One of the articles I read about this book maintained that the “myth” was invented in the 30s, but they had a contemporary cartoon illustration at the head of the article that was clearly much older than that.
The Gilded Age was written in 1873. “Mr Dooley” was satirizing Andrew Carnegie et al between 1893 and 1926. “The Devil’s Dictionary” came out between 1875 and 1911 and included this definition:
RICHES, n.
A gift from Heaven signifying, “This is my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased.” John D. Rockefeller
The reward of toil and virtue. J.P. Morgan
The savings of many in the hands of one. Eugene Debs
To these excellent definitions the inspired lexicographer feels that he can add nothing of value.
AGGHHHH! Not another libertarian/Randian effort to portray the Robber Barons are “these really swell guys who did all these wonderful things until stupid government got involved.”
They produced real goods and services which improved the standard of living.
There are 2 main things in economics (either order)
1) There is no Free Lunch (TANSTAFL – “ain’t no such thing as a”),
2) Incentives matter.
Among incentives there are two types: carrots and sticks. Positive & negative.
She’s asking – where is the positive incentive? And she’s kind of correct in that ending the current negative regime of lockdowns is a relative positive incentive.
We give back your freedom (ending negative repression)
if you do what we want.
Or else we continue suppressing you. (continued negative situation)
[Listening to Nilsson’s The Moonbeam Song, thanks to his too technical cool Bojangles version, and remembering this one. Didn’t get to it from City of New Orleans but thought of it then, too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OTyuLj9RpY&list=PLgaFNC_I_ZkmJDk8iL9N6-Lwyx5jtYNtk&index=4 ]
If she wants a pure positive incentive, why not use the one that works best with most folks? Cash. Here’s my combined Vax and Stimulus $330 billion plan:
Send $1000 to all who have gotten vaccinated.
Once people are notified that they are eligible, when they get the second vaccine they also get $1000. (or just one jab for J&J)
Then, once there is no longer any shortage so that all are eligible and there are enough for everybody, the Vax Reward goes down $100/month so there remains an incentive to take it. This will be enough for herd immunity.
[ain’t there nothing I can take to relieve this belly ache?
I said Doctor? ain’t there nothing I can take? (3x)
I said Doctor? You such a silly woman… ]
Please note that negative incentives, the Stick, are much much cheaper. Which is why, throughout history, they have been more used.
Market capitalism works thru the positive incentive process – bakers bake bread. For YOU. For money. etc.
Robber Barons? [Take a Ride on the Reading RR]
After Stanford ditched the Indians, they had a vote by the students on a new mascot. Robber Barons won in 1975 – before I got there in ’76.
https://www.businessinsider.com/in-1975-stanford-voted-to-have-its-mascot-be-the-robber-barons-2016-6
The Stanford Alumni didn’t accept it – they’ve been the “Cardinals”, the color NOT the bird, since then. I kind of liked the Band’s mascot – the Tree.
M. Bunge, “these really swell guys who did all these wonderful things until stupid government got involved.”
Read “Chapters of Erie” by Charles and Henry Adams, grandsons and great grandsons of the Presidents, about the Erie Railroad wars to consolidate smaller railroads into larger ones right after the Civil War. It included twisted and corrupt financial maneuvering, a private army or two, and of course “ the legislatures of two states [NY and NJ], neither of them famed for purity. “ Corruption and government have been intertwined since the beginning of time. And money is the root of all evil, when people can’t find more entertaining ways of going bad.
Compare what the robber Barons left behind, the oil and steel industries, the railroads, the electric power system and much more, to our modern ultra rich. Zuckerberg, Facebook = home photo albums as an advertising platform. The Unabomber look-alike and Twitter = a platform for ultra low attention span reporters, and advertising. Google, find stuff on the internet in exchange for looking at advertisements.
I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday for a vaccination today?
Popeye explains economics.
It seems that folks worse than Homer Simpson run the DOHs and the CDC. What these health-o-crats are truly terrified of is the loss of social control that they have seized or been granted. It’s past time for them to pound sand.
Google, Facebook, Twitter: talk about robber barons.
Gobble now has a green light to steal whatever intellectual property it wants; all’s fair (use) in love (of power) and war. Thank you SCOTUS.
“We Americans cannot be trusted to make our own health care decisions, and any amount of COVID virus in the population is a reason for continuing the crackdown and deprivation of liberty.” – Neo
How about this for an incentive?
https://babylonbee.com/news/cdc-says-vaccinated-people-can-now-punch-unvaccinated-people-in-the-face
Works as a carrot for one side AND a stick for the other!
Om brought up Google and Facebook, but my comment also applies to Neo’s “Lies” post today.
Powerline had this in their headline picks yesterday.
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/17218/big-tech-threat
RTWT and, if even a part of what it says is true, be afraid.
Be very afraid.
BTW, this immediately ended any interest I might have had in Dr. Wen’s opinions (no science is involved).
Call me close-minded if you wish.
https://www.theblaze.com/news/cnn-analyst-urges-biden-administration-to-tie-vaccinations-to-americans-freedoms#toggle-gdpr
“Wen, the former president of Planned Parenthood,”
Wen strikes me as someone who was unfortunate enough to be quoted accurately, someone who lives within their small world and sees simple, effective ways to get things done that affect large populations to beneficial effect. She would have made a good Orkin technician, I think.
But having seen lots of Conservatives have their quotes cleverly parsed to make them look terrible, I suspect she probably didn’t intend for that to come across as horribly as it did.
Why would having degrees in medicine and biochemistry qualify someone as an expert in:
–Law
–Political Philosophy
–Marketing
…which are the subjects she is expressing a supposedly-authoritative opinion about?
A few days ago my local rag said that 8 fully vaccinated people in the state had become ill enough with Covid-19 to be hospitalized. They also noted that two people over 80 who were fully vaccinated had died after becoming ill with Covid-19. It was a small sentence in a bigger article about vaccinations.
I looked on line for information about this. I found an article by ABC that said this: “Finding evidence of vaccine breakthrough cases reminds us that, even if you have been vaccinated, you still need to wear a mask, practice socially distancing, and wash your hands to prevent spreading COVID-19 to others who have not been vaccinated,” Dr. Umair Shah, Washington state’s secretary of health, said in a statement Tuesday.”
Here’s the article:
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/100-fully-vaccinated-people-contract-covid-19-washington/story?id=76784838
They claim these breakthrough cases are to be expected. I’m no infectious disease expert, so I don’t know how to evaluate this except as more reasons for government control. This mass vaccination exercise is a work in progress and maybe still in the experimental phase. We are at the mercy of the medical bureaucrats.
If a vaccine is 85-90% effective then it is given to many millions of people that means A LOT of people will still get it.
How effective are flu vaccines?
Of course nobody cared about that.
Leland has the correct list of motivations, I think #3 the most likely. These experts, Dr. Wen, Dr. Fauci, Dr. Birx, enjoy their newly granted voice and power. If the virus is no longer a big, bad, broad threat then they are no longer needed or sought out. Can’t have that. As David+Foster says, why are we giving these people control and decision making power in areas that they are not experts in?
Something like 30 million people have had Covid. The plan is for 200 million to be vaccinated by the end of the month. That should mean, according to the science, that more than 2/3 of the US population are protected. And the remaining ones don’t generally get symptomatic Covid and are at little risk of developing serious health issues and death.
Open up.
HL Mencken called people like Dr. Wen “the uplifters” and they were just as bad in those Robber Baron days as today.
Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan remarked that one platitude which has remained relevant is that “experts should be on tap, not on top.”
My, how things change.
Here are all these freedoms that you have.’ Because otherwise, people are going to go out and enjoy these freedoms anyway.”
Yes they are – because their freedoms are endowed by our Creator. Not granted by government busybodies.
Neo posted the part of the C. S. Lewis “busybody” quote that has become famous … but wait, there’s more!! … to that quote, that is relevant.
They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be “cured” against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals.
But then again, we ordinary folks are willing to be directed like infants, coerced like imbeciles, and herded like domestic animals … if that is what is required to “follow the rules” set by “experts”.
Which is arguably one of the worst legacies of the Gilded Age … the age at which we seemed to have left our common sense and proximity-informed insight back on the farm as worthless, replacing it with the blind worship of education and expertise and ¡¡¡SCIENCE!!! … and their practitioners .. as we became cogs in the wheels of industry.
The “accepted” history of the Robber Barons is worthy of being called into question … and the acceptance of that history as reported is a distraction from the corrosive legacy above.
Leland on April 5, 2021 at 5:22 pm said:
That’s a great way to get people, who aren’t anti-vaxxers, to support those against vaccination.
My primary anti-vax position is not anything to do with mercury or planting chips or any of that. It’s solely based on the insistence of zero risk through gov’t coercion. It started with the anthrax shot in the military – just a bit of “Really? You think this has been weaponized? I think you’re living in Fearsville.”
But the HPV vaccine was the kicker. Vaccinating children for a disease almost exclusively transferred through sexual (and “similar”) activity because there was some chance it might cause cancer. These are children (iirc, 8yo or so) who are being vaccinated for a sexually transmitted disease. But it was “for their own good!”
I actually think the Wuhan Flu vaccines are good things. But, because of the hysteria over the virus, and the desire for absolute control evidenced by so many in the gov’t, I’m holding off. I won’t get it until things are free and open again, at this point in the game.
morgan on April 5, 2021 at 5:49 pm said:
I don’t know why the media keeps referring to her as such.
It’s an appeal to authority. Even if she doesn’t have it, she wears a lab coat, so the masses should shut up and listen to her (as long as she’s spouting something in line with the Zero Risk Safetyists).
Griffin on April 5, 2021 at 6:31 pm said:
It has become some kind of warped religious cult at this point.
Yes. It’s called Safetyism, and it’s a denomination of Progressivism.
Per Albert Camus:
“The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants, and it provides the further advantage of giving the servants of tyranny a good conscience.”
Tom Grey on April 5, 2021 at 7:55 pm said:
Please note that negative incentives, the Stick, are much much cheaper. Which is why, throughout history, they have been more used.
Ummmm, no. Mostly they’ve been used because power is easier and more satisfying to the controller than cajoling or bribing.
Paul In Boston on April 5, 2021 at 8:12 pm said:
And money is the root of all evil,
LOVE of money is the root of all evil.
Jester Naybor on April 6, 2021 at 7:27 am said:
Nailed it. Progressivism is partly about worshipping a god named Science!. The lower priests are the bureaucrats and experts (white lab coats seem to be their vestments), while the high priests are the politicians. The media are their prophets. All to achieve their utopia here on Earth.
“…immediately ended any interest…”
Actually, I would have thought that “CNN” would have been sufficient…
Neo: Echoing “Fandor” above at 6:08, I too love your blog and am coming over from Althouse. Althouse put a lot of work into her blog as I know you do too; but when she closed the comments feature, it really took away something which I, perhaps selfishly, find important. Call it feedback, call it noisy background, call it the makings of democratic discourse; whatever, it’s important to me and, apparently, others. I very much hope that our participation will not create inordinate effort on your part to maintain good order and produce a characteristically high-toned and informative conversation.
It started as “wear a mask OR stay 6 feet apart”
Which rapidly became “wear a mask AND stay 6 feet apart”.
Now it’s “get vaccinated, wear a mask AND stay 6 feet apart”.
And, BTW, if you have to get an annual flu shot because the antibodies don’t last more than 6 months, what makes you think a COVID “vaccine” will be any different? If the COVID “vaccine” only provides a few months of protection then the vaccination effort will likely prolong the pandemic. Those in danger of dying from COVID should get vaccinated, just like they should get the annual flu shot, the rest should do whatever they think is appropriate because, ultimately, the experts don’t have any actual expertise.
The whole lockdown fiasco boils down to the experts not being willing to say “there’s nothing we can do”.
Owen – welcome aboard. Neo has been one of my big reads for a while, and while I didn’t comment much at Althouse, I thoroughly enjoyed reading the comment threads there.
This is definitely a more welcoming environment.
I Callahan @ 9:13: thanks for the welcome. It’s that kind of congeniality (and wit; and curiosity; and willingness to kick around a topic until, maybe, it assumes a better shape) that really makes blogosphere worthwhile. The very converse of “cancel culture.”
Yes.
I followed Althouse on a daily basis. Now that she’s eliminated the comments section I’ve deleted her blog from my favorites list.
A daily diet of the NYT and thoughts of the Madison bourgeoisie is indigestible.
Dr. Wen is a Rhodes Scholar. I know a fair number of them. I think they suffer disproportionately from elitism: often visible as a smug dismissal of any data or opinion that doesn’t reinforce their ever-so-thoughtful and peer-reviewed POV. No question, they can accomplish much useful work, and not all of them are so afflicted; but it’s an occupational hazard among powerful wonky folk who have to go to extraordinary lengths to sample any reality but that of their intellectual Versailles.
If a vaccine is 85-90% effective then it is given to many millions of people that means A LOT of people will still get it.
No, they’ll get it if the virus is established in their area. Enough of the population is immune, the virus dies out.
“…indigestible…”
Now there’s an interesting angle: the NYT (et al.), once genuinely useful as fish wrap and/or birdcage liner has been retooled as a prime provider of intellectual roughage….
File under: All the dietary fiber that’s fit to print?
LeClerc
I followed Althouse on a daily basis. Now that she’s eliminated the comments section I’ve deleted her blog from my favorites list.
I’d guess that traffic to her blog will crash.I’ll certainly stop looking at Althouse, though I may look at the 600+ comment posting where she discussed changing her comments policy. I have no idea what the economics of eliminating comments will be for Althouse.
Caracas Chronicles, an English language anti-Chavista blog on Venezuela, stopped comments 2 years ago. The main reason for stopping comments was that the proprietors were having problems keeping comments civil as a result of their decidedly anti-Trump editorial stances. (While Obama had done things that didn’t help the cause of democratic government in Venezuela, CC criticism of Obama was minimal.) This was also a cultural conflict. Venezuelan politics, even anti-Chavista politics, veers to the left, as a result of Venezuela’s having an economy based on government distribution of oil revenue. Many of the CC commenters were Americans who had worked in Venezuela, and exposure to government-run companies in Venezuela had turned many of them to the right.
My daily readings of Caracas Chronicles have fallen to skimming once a month. As I wasn’t contributing any money to CC, I imagine the proprietors don’t miss my absence. But at the same time, there is one less US citizen who cares about Venezuela. (I worked in Venezuela, and also worked in the US with a small company that employed a lot of Venezuelans, so my interest in Venezuela had been long-lasting.)
I wonder if Althouse’s stopping comments is part of a bigger campaign to squeeze non-progressive views out of the Internet. 🙂
I read The Myth of the Robber Barons years ago.
If anything, it will give you a different perspective about their actions / accomplishments – good and bad.
It will actually make you think, as opposed to simply accepting the typical left wing dogma promoted by historians and which is generally accepted without question.
What did I learn from the book?
That government – state governments in particular – and their favored businessman were just as corrupt and dishonest as any of the “robber barons.”
The politically connected businesses, run by members of the elite, “proper” social classes, received “special legal dispensation” to run their businesses with no competition.
Recall, back then competition was considered evil, a bad thing because it would disrupt the status quo and harm the entrenched business / political social structure that was run by the “old” money elites. These old money elites generally had inherited their fortunes.
The robber barons – who also had no problem engaging in “dirty tricks” to increase their wealth and reach – were especially hated by the elitist, old money , wealthy politically connected ruling elites who ran and owned politically “protected” businesses.
The elites found it abhorrent that men from working class backgrounds (i.e., did not go to Harvard or Yale, etc, and who were of the ‘wrong’ social classes) could attain levels of wealth and power that previously was restricted to those who “deserved” such wealth.
The robber barons were no angels, but neither were they all bad.
Their rise and demise – and the challenge they presented to the established ruling elites – was an evolutionary step in transforming the US economy from mostly individually (or few person) owned , small business firms to stock ownership corporations.
I will speculate that if the robber barons has been members of the established , old money, ruling elites and members of the proper social classes, the term “robber barons” never would have come into use and perhaps antitrust laws would not have been enacted. After all, politicians would have been averse to enacting legislation that would have harmed their good pals.
Barry Meislin:
Indigestible, but they probably use soy-based ink?
Althouse closed comments for a while years ago (Obamaphone lady and spooge stooge were the proximate events, IIRC).
Some enterprising sort opened a blog named Althouse Comments, or some such. The regulars just kept on commenting.
BTW, Neo, I can’t believe you used the word ‘slant’ in this post. Tsk, tsk.
ChrisS on April 6, 2021 at 9:00 am said:
And, BTW, if you have to get an annual flu shot because the antibodies don’t last more than 6 months, what makes you think a COVID “vaccine” will be any different?
It’s not that the antibodies don’t last more than 6 months, it’s because the flu strain changes every year. Memory B cells which produce antibodies against diseases we were vaccinated against in childhood persist a lifetime. Covid may yet prove to behave more like the flu and require annual vaccination, but it’s not because the antibodies don’t persist.
JJ, Michigan has had a similar occurrence: 246 vaccinated residents diagnosed with COVID; 3 dead https://tinyurl.com/jekc76dy
The goal is to normalize immunity and mitigate disease progression. Immunity is preexisting (e.g. coreactive), naturally acquired, and through vaccination. The disease can be prevented and mitigated with HCQ+Zn, and at later stages with Ivermectin. Vaccines are part of a risk management protocol, which in the real world do not require general participation.
I fully expect the vaccine to become mandatory after the incentive approach fails to use up all the vaccines that will be available after those who want it receive it. It’s about dollars and cents. But that being said, Oldflyer stated that he approves of the incentive carrot because he believes it is good to get it. Well, my husband almost died of his COVID-19 experience but it isn’t the SARS CoV-2 virus that almost killed him, it was the cytokine storm that ensued as a result of the hospital sending him home instead of treating him once he was sick with it. The cytokine storm is a result of his body’s overreaction to the spike protein, something that is not understood, but clearly an issue for him personally. If you think we want to introduce a spike protein to his body voluntarily, you would be WRONG. This doctor lays out exactly what we experienced (@ the 12:50 mark) and why what has been done and what wasn’t done in this pandemic has resulted in our current miasma (pun intended). My own experience was, over it in 3 days, only to really suffer from it after wearing an N95 mask for 20 minutes the day of recovery, resulting in battling for 2 weeks using nothing other than rest, fluids and food for full recovery. I’ve been 100% fine since (1 year ago).
https://youtu.be/wPbxOeYAC7s
Separately, information about non-medical treatments, including masks:
Postoperative wound infections and surgical face masks: a controlled study
Effectiveness of Adding a Mask Recommendation to Other Public Health Measures to Prevent SARS-CoV-2 Infection in Danish Mask Wearers
Physical interventions to interrupt or reduce the spread of respiratory viruses
Follow the science, not intuition.
Also, nearly 80% of the cases are in people who are overweight: “fat is beautiful” is a comorbidity past, present, and progressive.
Planned Parent/hood is one of the few venues and practices where there are excess deaths on a year over year basis. Primary spread occurs in a captive population within lock downs. The virus was already in the wild, and as on the ship, is likely spread through fecal transmission. Disease progression is correlated with comorbidities correlated with age.
Robert Shotzberger on April 5, 2021 at 4:35 pm said:
“The so called “Robber Baron” also gave back generously to the citizens. They provided for the NY Public Library, perhaps the finest public library in world.”
I am going to quibble with Robert on this. The wording of his statement implies that he bought into the notion that the industrial tycoons’ wealth was taken from the public. It was not. They created wealth that did not previously exist. And in the process, they created employment and demand for labor that raised wages for everyone.
It was never necessary that they engage in philanthropy to justify their wealth. It should never be necessary for any individual to justify their wealth, abilities, or their existence.
The “God complex” is common enough among MDs and DOs that it’s practically stereotypical. If my physician tries to get dictatorial, I can either ignore him (he’s not dictatorial, but I have ignored his recommendations about statins) or change doctors.
The issue with public health doctors is that they have access to the levers of government with the physical coercive power that entails.
Perhaps Dr. Wen didn’t mean what it sounded like, but the negative reactions have been a good thing to remind public health officials that, while we may seem sheeplike, wearing our masks even when we know how dumb it is,there is a line.
@SonnyWayz:
Well done, Sir! You found a Chink in her armor!
(This afternoon bumped into a Chinese friend down at the Plaza and we both agreed it was Pfizer Biontech for us both and no way were we going to try the Chinky (sic) Vax.)
Not much PC out here in the Indias of Spice and Mine.