The election fraud cases: the already-thick plot thickens over Sidney Powell’s role
I’m going to start out by repeating something I wrote on November 18 about the election fraud cases [emphasis added]:
…I hear amazing allegations [about election fraud] and we just don’t know what’s true and what isn’t. So I’ll just put some of it here for your perusal and you can judge for yourself.
I will add that, for the most part, with election fraud an ounce of prevention is worth a million tons of cure.
Fraud can be prevented if the will is there and more rigorous rules for voting are in place. But it takes two parties to want it, and that is definitely not the case in the US today and especially not this year. Once that prevention horse is out of the barn, proving that fraud actually occurred and finding a remedy for what happened is nearly impossible. Fraudsters know that. The motivation to commit fraud is sky-high, and if there’s an opportunity they will try to do it and may indeed succeed. Even if fraud hasn’t happened, vulnerability of the system will encourage the strong suspicion on the part of a great deal of the public that fraud has occurred, which is a very bad thing as well.
The answer is to offer little or no opportunity for fraud. Much much too late for that.
That’s what I have thought from the beginning, although it’s not a happy thought. In fact, it was my fear for many months prior to the election, once I learned how much the rules and ordinary safeguards against election fraud had been relaxed. I stand by it now that this story has come out:
Sources close to the president told the Washington Examiner neither the White House nor the Trump campaign have seen any of the evidence [Powell] claims to have related to assertions about voting machines switching millions of votes from President Trump to President-elect Joe Biden. They argued that her claims overshadowed what they see as legitimate concerns about the mail-in ballot process.
Even national security officials within the Trump administration said they have seen no evidence of Powell’s claims.
“Sidney has made these claims, but she has not shown, to my knowledge, evidence to support them — not to the campaign and not to the White House. … I don’t know anyone who has seen the evidence,” one senior administration official told the Washington Examiner. “Where is that evidence? The more she goes out there, the more it overshadows the legitimate problems. … The problem with this stuff is that you got so over-the-top, and you overshadow the illegitimate improper things that were done.”
My perception is that there were always three different types of cases to bring. First we have cases connected to the rule changes that were set up with COVID as a reason or an excuse, prior to the election – that is, things that include (just to take one example) whether it was legal to have a state supreme court change the rules passed by a state legislature that is solely tasked with drawing them up.
The second group includes the type of case that alleges that all sorts of voting irregularities occurred during the counting of the votes in the large Democratic cities (such as Philadelphia and Detroit) in certain swing states. These anomalies include, for example, throwing out Republican observers or making them stand so far away they could see nothing meaningful, shutting down counting for many hours (or just pretending to as an excuse for sending observers home), changing the dates on ballots that arrived after the deadline, allowing voters in Democratic districts to “cure” errors on mail-in ballots while denying the opportunity to those in Republican districts, and bringing in huge truckloads of ballots for Biden in the wee morning hours. These claims rest on affidavits submitted under penalty of perjury, and presumably many of these witnesses would be willing to testify in a trial.
The third group involves the claims by attorney Sidney Powell that the Dominion voting machines were programmed to tally votes in a way that favored Biden. This was the strangest and in some ways the most disturbing of the charges if it were true, but it depends either on statistical and/or software analysis or insider whistleblowing and seems even more difficult to prove or to even understand if one is not conversant with software development. I had and still have no idea whether Powell can back up these charges, and I can’t imagine that many of the people opining about it one way or the other actually know.
So, because of this difference among the types of fraud cases, it makes sense to me that they would be separated. Which brings us to what happened yesterday:
…[T]he Trump campaign released a statement saying [Powell] is not a member of their team.
“Sidney Powell is practicing law on her own,” Giuliani and Ellis said. “She is not a member of the Trump Legal Team. She is also not a lawyer for the President in his personal capacity.”
Powell released a statement to CBS News later in the day.
“I understand today’s press release. I will continue to represent #WeThePeople who had their votes for Trump and other Republicans stolen by massive fraud through Dominion and Smartmatic, and we will be filing suit soon.
Perhaps she was misled by lying witnesses, perhaps she has gone off the deep end (the Flynn case could do it), or perhaps she has tons of convincing evidence we have yet to see.
But we don’t know.
I would like to know more about all three types of cases. I would especially like some clear information about the relevant rules for voting in each state in which irregularities have been alleged, and exactly how those rules are alleged to have been violated in each case, as well as how many fraudulent votes for Biden are alleged to have occurred as a result, and how those figures were arrived at with what evidence. I’ve tried to cull that information from newspaper articles, and I’ve not been able to do it so far (not that I’ve spent hundreds of hours on the task).
Mail-in voting is widely shunned and/or strictly limited around the world because it is known to be inherently vulnerable to fraud. I think its expanded US use is the big problem here – a problem that kept me up nights prior to the election, even though there obviously wasn’t a thing I could do about it. What’s more, I thought fraud allegations would rear their ugly head no matter which candidate won.
But Trump’s legal challenges to the election results are being treated right now as though they are an unconscionable affront to democracy. However, I think that by far the greater affront involves trying to stop or discredit a challenge before it goes through the court system, and/or saying fraud doesn’t exist here before we’ve even seen the evidence. After all, if significant fraud occurs and it remains unchallenged, it means not only that the wrong person is in office and the will of the voters has been thwarted, but it ensures that more fraud will happen next time and will probably grow in magnitude unless measures are taken to prevent it.
Democrats called Trump an illegitimate president from the start and repeatedly tried to discredit and remove him from office based on lies and illegal leaks. The last four years of these activities have constituted the single most destabilizing political element in my lifetime. And yet now the same people are crying foul because some fraud cases are being brought to court resulting from a messy and chaotic system that they allowed to occur and in many cases even advocated.
I would very much like to see measures put in place to make fraud difficult if not impossible. I’d like to see an end to automatic mail-in ballots and automatic mail-in ballot requests being mailed to everyone on the voter rolls in certain states. I’d like to see voter rolls cleaned up. I’d like to see many more limitations placed on absentee ballots as well, and very stringent requirements for signature verification and the like. I’d like to see mostly in-person voting on a single day or at the most two days – perhaps with expanded hours and voting places, and IDs required. I’d like to see some sort of meaningful enforcement of the rules on observers, because once they’re kicked out it’s too late. I’d like to see a requirement that the envelopes from absentee ballots be saved and available to be looked at and matched with the absentee ballot requests if there is a challenge. And I’d like to see safe and non-hackable counting and tabulating systems in place.
And we need not just to stop voting fraud, but to stop or greatly reduce even the perception of voting fraud as a real possibility. And that can only be accomplished by tightening up the rules.
But as the song says, you can’t always get what you want. And so I don’t see any of these things ever coming to be, except perhaps in red states, because that list runs counter to the desires of the left.
[NOTE: And of course the MSM is worse than worthless, treating issues quite differently depending on which side is making the allegations. Just one little example for today is to contrast what the MSM is writing now about voting machines and fraud with this NBC story from last December, which states:
A new level of scrutiny of the election system, spurred by Russia’s interference in the 2016 election, has put ES&S in the political spotlight. The source of the nation’s voting machines has become an urgent issue because of real fears that hackers, whether foreign or domestic, might tamper with the mechanics of the voting system.
That has led to calls for ES&S and its competitors, Denver-based Dominion Voting Systems and Austin, Texas-based Hart Intercivic, to reveal details about their ownership and the origins of the parts, some of which come from China, that make up their machines…
The secrecy of ES&S and its competitors has pushed politicians to seek information on security, oversight, finances and ownership. This month, a group of Democratic politicians sent the private equity firms that own the major election vendors a letter asking them to disclose a range of such information, including ownership, finances and research investments.
“The voting machine lobby, led by the biggest company, ES&S, believes they are above the law,” said Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., a member of the Intelligence Committee who co-signed the letter. “They have not had anybody hold them accountable even on the most basic matters.”
Hearings before Congress seem to have been held, but it doesn’t seem like much was revealed or resolved. Bills to supposedly improve things stalled amidst disagreements between the parties on how best to go about it. I haven’t been able to find out much about what those disagreements were. But I know we’re paying now for that lack of agreement.]
See: https://amgreatness.com/2020/11/22/fraud-evidence-proof-power/
I don’t think the alleged contretemps is anything more than misinformation or miscommunication. Special Counselor to Trump, Jenna Ellis, has corrected this, saying that Powell is a volunteer and keeping her own trusted, independent team.
More important is the status of this potentially enormous investigation. Some evidence will be posted online this week, Powell reports. “Keeping Up With Simone GAO” has an up to date 18 minute report on the case
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgDyeNJ4FBk
Gao relates that a Trump Campaign spokesman Brian Thrascher (?) and a talk show interviewer with lawyer Lin Wood and Steve Bannon all agree that there is something big there.
One sensational aspect that that Dominion has closed offices in Denver, Toronto, and principals have removed their Linked-In online information. For a supposedly reputable firm, this is disturbing if not disreputable behavior that provides vote services in 29 states.
Another sensational angle is the alleged raid on Dominion offices — gaining access to computers used in the US elections found — in Frankfurt (Scytle?), Germany, which Brian Thrascher confirms as event that happened, yielding important new information.
“Sick” or “global” and “Biblical proportions” are alarums tossed out to prepare us. THIS, in a year of unprecedented events, is to paint this Powell case with an even high bar to meet. “Criminal conspiracy” is also used, a term not often joined to ”election fixing.” But this year? Why the Hell not?
If so, then certified elections will have to be de-certified if only because a storm of outrage is soon coming.
I hope so. Because if this election is a fraud, then we really are at war with the state and the Evil Ruling Class so welded to throttle it, given the broken social contract this entails.
But who will show up to fight this war out in the streets with a vengeance if enormous crimes seem committed, and no one does anything? And no on is held to pay for it?
Just like all the many other “400 Blows” of American political family dysfunction that Trump has exposed, but fallen like a tree in the woods? But, Perhaps AG Barr’s silence is not like a wife-beating husband’s? (Ie, NOT evidence of complicity and guilt.)
No matter how horrifying, different this time can only be better. We are, otherwise, the forever Chumps.
The Sidney kerfuffle was discussed at the JustOneMinute blog. This theory is one contender, despite author “sundance” being held in low esteem.
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2020/11/22/republican-business-interests-separate-from-sidney-powell/
“Historically the GOP was dependent on big major donors and Wall Street for support, but the Trump small donor army shattered all republican records for contributions and showed a completely new grassroots donor base. Tens of millions of middle-class Americans fueled the MAGA movement and stunned the republican establishment.”
“The Trump MAGA file is being exploited like a bloody carcass dropped into a pool of piranha. ”
“The Trump campaign isn’t going to reimburse Sidney Powell for any expenses, nor is she allowed to make offers of financial payment from the GOP or Trump campaign. The vultures assembling and protecting their paychecks do not want Powell getting paid … The same network of vultures exists on the DNC side of the equation and they exploit Bernie Sanders’ donor files. … RNC Chairwoman Ronna McDaniel has enjoyed a high life of cocktail parties and lavish expenditures as a result of her position and control over the Trump data files.”
Isn’t it possible that part of the reason for the “distancing” is Powell’s relationship to Gen. Flynn? If President Trump fails to overcome the election fraud, he is going to be forced to pardon Gen. Flynn, and for the General’s attorney to also be acting for the President might be an unnecessary complication. Unless of course all the above were Democrats, in which case it would be just hunky-dory!
Ps. The centrality of Gen. Flynn to everything the Democrats have done since 2016 is greatly under-appreciated, IMHO. Flynn not only knows where the bodies are buried, but he knows what the CIA can do and has done in fixing elections all over the world, including here in the USA.
Conservatives had qualms about Covid mail-in voting, just as they have had for all loose voting practices advocated by Democrats.
However, successfully fighting against that months ago in the midst of Covid would have been difficult, probably impossible.
Now we’ve been burned and half the voters will back cracking down and increasing election security. It will have to be a top priority.
IF AMERICANS DEMAND TO VOTE SECURELY, THEN LET THE PURPLE FINGERS ONLY “Great American Vote Strike” COMMENCE.
the Dems profit from the fraud, see vote harvesting in southern california, that was offset in part by the new voter enthusiasm, this is all a cover for what the administrative state, wanted to do, and was hampered by the administration, we see more evidence that harris, in particular, was benefited by her husbands boss, nigel knowles, who happens to be on the board of smartmatic,
Exactly, TJ. It’s a ‘tell’ when people who litigate elections as part of their professional portfolio declare that the best elections are paper-based ballots, hand-counted with plenty of witnesses. I would be happy to simplify our election process by this method, and will argue the case in my local setting. We only get what we allow, when it comes to elections. @Laurence Jarvik Thanks for the Codevilla share.
Some have remarked on how RED (exc. Ga) state election went smoothly and all votes were counted in 24 hours. Most if not all RED states use Real ID as voting ID.
Like most everyone, I have pondered this situation at length.
It made no sense. Then it did. Maybe.
As Neo points out, there are three avenues of possible pursuit.
I have felt, and still do, that contesting the legality of the process in key states was most likely to succeed. There is a clear constitutional standard; and it was not met.
So, I suspect, with little corroborating justification, that the Trump team wants to pursue that aggressively, and does not want a distraction.
I don’t know what Sidney Powell has, or doesn’t have. But, I don’t think she is a “nut case” as the Media and their accomplices would have us believe. I do think that wherever she is going, the Trumpsters see it as a possibly damaging distraction. If she is going to pursue a wide spread conspiracy (and who would be fool enough to argue that it is not possible, even probable, after living through the past four years?) that would be huge. But, the focus must be as narrow as a laser beam on the path to winning the election. Other matters cannot dilute the story now. They can be pursued once the election is won. If the election is not won, game over. Her charges will die unborn, or postpartum, just like Democrats treat an unwanted child.
Obviously, my theory is open to critique.
I think Robert Barnes makes sense in that Viva frei interview makes sense. A central concern is signature verification integrity, and that’s one of Trump’s best attacks, since it’s the point at which if invalid ballots get accepted, you can recount forever and the results will remain the same.
Here in my home state, Washington, that has used mail in ballots for over a decade, it’s the weak link in the voter integrity.
As a local election official told me, we need to trust the integrity of the people doing that job! I may trust my local, solidly conservative election officials, but I certainly don’t trust those leftists in other counties.
If, in fact, states where they didn’t verify the signature, has laws requiring it, that seems to be a solid case to cast doubt on the election in that state.
As to Powell’s apocalyptic assertion that Dominion machines can manufacture votes at will, the Trump team distanced themselves, but possibly too late. This whole Qanon narrative is damaging to the case.
Qanon hasn’t been very reliable since it started in 2016.
I found this article to be appalling.
Dominion has a BMD or Ballot Marking Device that can mark the little ovals on a paper ballot using a printer. The idea is that disabled folks with poor vision or motor skills can vote with a large touchscreen and then the machine creates a paper ballot that looks like it was voted by hand with a pen.
But the machine does not print with perfect oval black marks. Instead the computer has a large library of fake hand made pen strokes, so to a less than forensic examination the ballot looks like it was hand made. The excuse for this technology? From Dominion’s promo video with Dr. Coomer:
I’m guessing that if one could intercept the electrical connection between the touchscreen device and the ballot printing hardware, one could easily mass produce ballots by the thousands.
Paper ballots administered by federal officers and poll workers sort of like the census. It’s not perfect but reduces the chance of fraud if the poll workers aren’t local union. It’s why the Romans never allowed their Auxiliaries to serve in their home provinces.
Robert Barnes with Viva Frei has a long Sunday night chat that’s usefully critical of Sydney Powell. Start at 28minutes:
https://rumble.com/vbch9b-powells-release-the-kraken-a-dud-elections-update-viva-and-barnes.html
Barnes has worked with conspiratorial types (eg, federal criminal tax law), who hold conspiratorial briefs, and he’s helped people to see past the weaknesses of their stances before a court.
Powell’s spread case brief, he argues, can sell in the Court of Public Opinion, but not in Court. The spread makes too few qualitative distinctions to parse best, most likely to succeed arguments and not pursued, instead, staying with the wooly and hardest to prove possibilities.
He worries that she’s too naive to election law, and too facile on the facts, and thus a likely victim of disinformation, as well as her grandiosity recently stoked since the spring.
This, Barnes says, makes her ripe for over expecting/ over promising/ and hyper stating a case that needs stat or quant muscle to clearly explain and convince others. A woman’s gotta know her limitations: she’s missing the power of constraints in argument framing.
Barnes thinks Team Trump lost the latter under the circus of the former. Too much Sydney. But maybe they can recover and get back on track?
I find his emphasis on simple explanations such as signature check regulations. The whole Dem campaign of Sec of State’s to intimidates them into not checking them. Was by design.
This basic checking is powerful evidence of vote fraud to people, easily understandable, and compelling. Why the lack of transparency? Why do post election Dems hate this being done?
Thus, Barnes is sympathetic to Trucker Carlson’s skepticism and push back.
I find Barnes lesson “Don’t be a victim of aggressive disinformation campaigns” to be insightful, powerful, and even useful elsewhere.
Lots to chew over in this long streamed video.
I can’t imagine Powell gets paid by some variant of clicks. The big promises may help fundraising, but if this is a big nothing, won’t pay for much of her retirement.
How about this: There are so many players in the Dominion issue–writ large–that she’s figuring she can spook some of them into either turning, or doing something stupid in panic which will allow for new avenues of investigation. After all, wiping your hard drive and burning your paper files and fading off into some IT job someplace probably doesn’t hold much horror for the folks who’ve participated or watched the frauds going on. Federal prison might scare them out of a rational, measured withdrawal option.
@ TJ,says,
Did Gao provide a direct link to Thrasher making an unequivocal assertion that the United States government had seized an election server overseas?
Re the “One sensational aspect that that Dominion has closed offices in Denver, Toronto, and principals have removed their Linked-In online information. “, business:
I`ll allow that the Meaning in History author who I excoriated for his uncritical rehash and embellishment of rumor, did offer up one interesting link … but no worthwhile critical analysis of course on his part … to an apparently youngish female Internet sleuth who claimed she had been doing complex tracing of published interpersonal and corporate connections reaching from Sandia Labs to Serbian programers. The latter who, she claims deleted their Linkedin professional profiles after she had accessed them.
Her actual twitter feed, not the thread reader app M in H linked to.
https://mobile.twitter.com/jessiprincey/status/1329824978544578562
Now, regardless of how incompetent and uncritical the Meaning in History guy might be, her claims , if they are hers, are probably worth white-boarding just for tne heck of it. Of course the visit to her Twitter account shows that others are claiming it is not actuslly her work and research, while Twitter also flags her comments with “disputed” warnings.
Looks like free speech dies about the same time critical sense and moral restraint and courage, do.
Here is an interesting suggestion from Red State:
https://redstate.com/diary/martin_a_knight/2020/11/22/its-time-for-a-citizens-audit-of-this-election-n283353
I don’t know how practical it is.
So far as statistical anomalies are concerned, some are in plain sight, e.g., the preposterously low rejection rates for mail-in ballots in some places. That is true even compared with pre-2020 rates, and absurdly so compared with the earlier primaries. Numbers like that are prima facie evidence of either incompetence or fraud; either way, they pollute the vote.
And that is the bottom line. Was the vote so badly compromised as to make it worthless? For other races, a do-over would be called. Here, it would mean the House, presumably.
so you can’t disagreggate the legit ballots from the illegitmate ones, unless you have a digital record, one thing I noticed is judge totenberg, doubting the sincerity of dominion, the two members on the 11th circuit appointed by trump, lagoa (Who was under consideration for supreme court justice) and brasher who replaced carney, accepted no paper backups, for georgia,
Btw, the 3rd circuit accepted expedited review of brann’s decision,
@ Aubrey,
Yes you are right. She is about as likely to frighten them (if there is a “them”) into panicked contrition, as the sneering Peter Strsok was likely to take Congress seriously. Or Lois Lerner, or any of the rest. Even jail does not really frighten them
Why is it – as a general observation – that people who abide the rules, imagine that the uninhibited who care nothing for them, will come to Jesus somehow if the alternative is made to look dire?
They … don’t … believe … in … the premise, or the consequences.
And if they did, they would still sneer and curse, because it is their untrammeled will and impulses they revere, not some supposed metaphysical order.
If there were a God, they would spit in his face if they caught up with him.
I work the polls in Oakland county, Mich., north of Detroit. We have a sound system. It’s quick with results and backed up with paper ballots. We have people who can catch mistakes and I think it’s trustworthy when people vote in person. Throw everything I said in the trash if it’s done by mail and en masse.
DNW asks me “Did Gao provide a direct link to Thrasher making an unequivocal assertion that the United States government had seized an election server overseas?”
It’s an interview clip of Thrasher from other sources. See the LINK. It’s not far in the video.
Now, this could all be appalled group reflections, reflecting outrage. But via Twitter, Powell is sharing a document that Dominion submitted the the Chinese Bank HSBC containing their proprietary coding work as loan collateral.
I haven’t seen it yet — servers overloaded. But I can only guess it’s significance without more. Obviously, this might suggest IP sharing and security issues with their business.
Mark Levin, on his program last night emphasized that the low hanging fruit to delaying election certifications in certain states was the fact that State courts, County officials, Governors, or their appointees; not the legislatures, in swing states made changes to election law in violation of the Constitution. (“per Article II Section II Clause II, each state’s legislature has the power over election laws.”)
He opines that the Trump legal team should be pursuing that avenue because it is simple and easy to understand. He also pointed out that this is a civil, not criminal, matter. Hard evidence is not required to begin a case. “Affidavits from credible individuals that raise a reasonable question are enough to establish a need for expedited discovery per the rules of civil procedure.” In his opinion, that is the best route to getting the election certifications delayed and getting expedited discovery orders.
The Dominion machine algorithm is a long shot. Sidney Powell may have something there (or it may be disinformation), but the implications of what is implied has explosive effects, not only on election security, but international relations/security. It’s straight out of a James Bond scenario. IMO, it would take the combined efforts of the FBI and NSA to run the hard evidence to ground. The time required is not available between now and the meeting of the Electoral College. However, some agency of government must investigate these Dominion accusations (and it might as well be the FBI) between now and the next election. I doubt Slo Joe will do such a thing. Could a private firm take on such an investigation? I don’t know. Might be worth looking into by the RNC.
Powell is the defender of Flynn. Flynn’s vindication is of paramount importance. No point in throwing Sidney under the bus. If Trump doesn’t prevail in court he has to pardon Flynn before Sullivan can do any further harm.
Clock ticking on Durham. Come on Bill Barr !
Darn if I understand what’s going on. I am told that Powell has alleged that Gov. Kemp has been bribed by someone to overlook the Dominion voting problems. That’s a wild accusation, and she is unlikely to have proof of that. Absent hard proof, this is not at all helpful to the effort.
well his former chief of staff, jared thomas, was the dominion lobbyist, who pitched the system to the state, don’t know of any money changing hands, but then think of theranos,
This doesn’t have to be an either or situation regarding Powell. I do think the President was smart to distance from Powell and make it clear she’s pursuing Dominion separately. The fact that she was at the President’s lawyers press briefing does muddy the waters.
One of the points Robert Barnes makes that I had heard previously to this Viva frei video on Youtube and also Rumble was the fact that historically about 3% of absentee ballots were rejected for signature reasons and only about .5% were rejected this election. The Trump team needs to pursue this and require an audit of the signature match. He’s confident that alone will disallow enough ballots to put Trump ahead of the count in Georgia. Assuming other states are the same or worse it would affect other states as well.
In my opinion, electronic voting machines, Dominion or any other, should be outlawed in favor of a paper ballot and optical scanner system, in which the voter puts the ballot into the tabulator, and the total number of ballots tabulated must equal the number of voters who were given ballots at that location.
If Kemp was persuaded by a lobbyist to support electronic voting, he made a big mistake, but that’s not the same as being bribed. I need evidence.
Up in Canada the vote in person – after proper ID is presented – and they use paper ballots.
No voting machines of any sort.
Filled out ballots are placed, by the voter, in a box.
All is witnessed by representatives of the relevant political parties to make sure all is legit.
Any computerized system – personal, voting, corporate, agency, etc., – can get hacked.
Even if they do not get hacked, who will review the thousands of lines of code that is the software.? It seems that a few lines of code can be inserted – that is dormant and undetectable – until it’s needed to sway a vote, upon which time it is activated.
And even if the voting system is not hacked or the code is “pristine,” what’s to stop somebody from inserting a thumb drive into either a voting machine(s) or into the computer that tallies all the results from around the state?
Voting in person by paper ballot, having proper ID and allowing full observation of the process is really the only way to minimize voting fraud.
For those who cannot vote in person (e.g. military) absentee ballots should be issued ONLY to those who request them.
The mail-in, non-absentee voting should be ended; it is a avenue for fraud.
Trump’s attorney’s had better have EVIDENCE specific to the presidential election that will stand up in the courts. Otherwise, Trump and his attorneys will look like total idiots and Guilian, Powell, et. al. will have destroyed themselves.
DNW I meant the worker bees. To mix a metaphor, the folks thrown to the wolves to lighten the sled.
We know law enforcement is more likely to go after those who don’t look as if they could pay a million in legal fees.
What do you know? What happened? According to Powell, the feds have no scruples whatsoever. Problem is, whose side are they on? The more Powell has, the less wiggle room the feds have. Probably.
But I see the DoJ has told Senator–that is US SENATOR Rand Paul they won’t be inconveniencing the mob which assaulted him–US SENATOR Rand Paul–and his family.
Trump’s attorney’s had better have EVIDENCE specific to the presidential election that will stand up in the courts. Otherwise, Trump and his attorneys will look like total idiots and Guilian, Powell, et. al. will have destroyed themselves. –JohnTyler
Another consequence is that it will make the voting reforms spoken of here much harder to push past the Democrats in the future.
First order goal of protests – No certification of compromised, probably fraud influenced elections in the states with Fraud cities. #StopTheSteal.us
Big protests might help convince courts, esp. SCOTUS, to do this.
Might not, probably won’t be, enough.
Continue protests against mail-in, and against counting machines.
– we need to Stop The Stealing in the future – like Georgia.
One person – one vote – in Person – with photo ID – paper ballots – counted in each precinct that night. Thousands of precincts, maybe tens of thousands of volunteer-workers plus observers.
It’s long been known how to have a very low fraud election. But Americans are lazy, even honest Americans. Mail-in is easier for the honest folk – but also a LOT easier for the frauds.
America needs honest elections.
Note what J. Turley was emphasizing, as was McCarthy – that the evidence presented didn’t justify not certifying the election, disenfranchising 8.3 million voters.
The only way to stop the fraud is to have courts NOT certify, because of the evidence of irregularities and the plausible, likely commission of significant fraud – because of lax state rules and rule enforcement.
That’s a message the SCOTUS can, and should, give “to the states”, who allowed the lousy rules and the irregular, seemingly illegal multi-violations of rules.
The courts should have, previously, NOT certified elections even earlier, even if it didn’t “change” the election. The idea that fraud claims are only actionable if they change the election is an invitation for more fraud. Which we’ve gotten a lot more of.
Mail-in ballots are here to stay. It was a mistake for Trump to not embrace them from the get go, especially in light of the Pandemic. How many seniors just didn’t want to vote in person? Think Netflix and the way America shops through Amazon and it’s obvious the GOP should embrace stay at home voting. We are probably not far away from a paperless voting option too. Think how secure PayPal an others like Apple Pay have become. So I say to Republicans, “You want vote by mail? We can do it better than you.”
I hope we correct this quickly by urging Georgians to use them in the runoffs. People are just not going to go and stand in long lines in the dead of winter.
Robert Brown:
They may indeed be here to stay. But they never should have been embraced, and they are not embraced in other countries because they are a set-up for fraud.
https://rumble.com/vbas2t-smoking-gun-dominion-transferring-vote-ratios-between-precincts-in-pa.-by-e.html
https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/11/its_in_the_code_hankypanky_in_virginias_votes.html
It’s all in the time stamp vote totals
Robert Brown,
Normally I use my mail in ballot for fire starter. I only sent this election’s back as a protest. I assure you that I will never bother again.
Some very interesting new developments and other stuff from Shipwreckedcrew’s twitter feed:
https://twitter.com/shipwreckedcrew
+ this:
https://redstate.com/shipwreckedcrew/2020/11/22/interesting-new-lawsuit-filed-in-pennsylvania-state-court-by-pennsylvania-gop-challenging-legality-of-vote-by-mail-n283630
See David Horowitz’s take:
https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/2020/11/fighting-words-david-horowitz/
Robert Brown is not my kind of guy. Not when he writes, “So I say to Republicans, “You want vote by mail? We can do it better than you.” I detect a Democrat in that remark, and I consider Democrats an unnecessary evil.
TJ on November 23, 2020 at 1:47 pm said:
I think that that latter is it. And attention seeking, and masquerading as someone important.
The guy looks like he is yapping from a cheap apartment office or something. Not a government supplied office
Trascher, https://twitter.com/btrascher?lang=en … “The Kajun Kracken” as he styles himself, is a Republican lobbyist in Louisiana and a low ranking member of the Trump reelection committee in that state. He is in no way an administration official, nor is there any reason to take him for a government insider privy to confidential information.
What he may actually know, or where he got it, I don’t of course know. But he looks like he is just repeating rumors he heard. No specifics whatsoever.
If a server in Europe handling voting tabulations in the United States, were confirmed as somehow seized by the United States government, it would be headline news with details, everywhere on earth, on a plethora of news sites, regardless of political leanings: Pictures, dates, location, official government spokesmen ..
Not some lobbyist … scroll to bottom
DNW:
I agree with you that there’s no reason to credit that particular report.
However, I disagree with this statement of yours: “If a server in Europe handling voting tabulations in the United States, were confirmed as somehow seized by the United States government, it would be headline news with details, everywhere on earth, on a plethora of news sites, regardless of political leanings.”
That would only happen if each side thought it would help them. If it benefited only the right, the MSM wouldn’t touch it with a ten-foot pole, and Twitter and Facebook would actively suppress it.
Neo, a quick Google search shows among other nations, the UK has had postal voting since the early 19th century. It is not all that different from what we do here. They have had many tightly contested elections as we all know with very little evidence of fraud. Here in Georgia for example, SOS Raffensberger said that there were a net 24,000 more mail-in ballots for Trump in the primary versus the General election. This alone would have won the state for Trump. With close races in Arizona, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, it could very well have been a different election night outcome.
From an hour ago:
“The Third Circuit Court of Appeals granted the Trump campaign’s request for an expedited review of a lower court’s decision to dismiss a lawsuit over voting in Pennsylvania.”
https://twitter.com/kylenabecker/status/1330992525738434561
OTOH:
“PA Supreme Court rules mail-in/absentee ballots w/o date or handwritten name/address can be counted….”
https://twitter.com/joshgerstein/status/1330975980278722560
and…
“The Michigan Board of State Canavassers voted to certify Michigan’s election results…”
https://twitter.com/kylenabecker/status/1330990377030070285
H/T Jeff Carlson twitter feed (all).
DNW,
One report I read (unconfirmed so worth exactly nothing) said the German Federal Police served the warrant and did the actual seizing,
The only way it could be kept hidden is if the Trump Administration suppressed it.
Fox News would certainly cover it, whatever they have become and however far one may imagine they have fallen. The New York Post would cover it if fed details by an Administration official. [I don’t know whether to cap or not when stand alone, as it becomes a kind of name LOL]
All it would take is one actual Administration official, with video, and images, and other graphics and evidence confirming what has been purported by the Twitteratti, and it would be all over, and then, virtually all over …
Or maybe if not the beginning of the end, at least the end of the beginning; as the great he himself said while puffing great clouds of bull doggishly determined smoke.
Cicero on November 23, 2020 at 5:18 pm said:
See David Horowitz’s take:
https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/2020/11/fighting-words-david-horowitz/
Robert Brown is not my kind of guy. Not when he writes, “So I say to Republicans, “You want vote by mail? We can do it better than you.” I detect a Democrat in that remark, and I consider Democrats an unnecessary evil.
Sorry, that was a poorly written sentence. I should have said, So it say to MY FELLOW Republicans… I’ve been a registered Republican for almost 60 years in the People’s Republic of California under the sterling leadership of comrade Newsom.
Some conflicting information is being bandied about:
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/elections/michigan-lawmakers-hold-hearing-election-irregularities-court-speeds
Things seem to be changing so fast that one has to continually check these things…
Chase Eagles,
To each his own. Some still use checks at the market versus credit cards or smart phones. We were way behind the Dems in computerized voter tracking and outreach systems after Obama’s 2012 win but we caught up fast and ours is now considered superior to the DNC’s. I’m simply saying we should be enhancing our voting process in the same way to match 21st century technology.
Let’s do a hypo: Everything Powell has said proves to be absolutely and irrefutable true. Well sourced, multiple sources, sworn affidavits, captured messages, screen shots. All of it.
What happens?
Robert Brown,
I have an extensive background in technology. I spent yesterday getting my wife’s development environment upgraded. She is developing an Apple Watch application on a Windows 10 box debugging across the network to a Watch simulator running on a Mac. I met her on the space program 40 years ago. I am not a technophobe.
I wonder if there’s a Goldilocks strategy going on. I think we all know that if you want to get a particular plan approved by management, you sandwich it between two unworkable or extreme plans. So where the goal is to sell the courts on a remedy, we have:
Powell: Dominion! Secret servers! Global conspiracy! Trump landslide! Reverse the whole election.Too hot
Democrats: Can’t prove nuthin’, don’t believe your lyin’ eyes. Do nothing. Too cold
Giuliani: Procedural misconduct, localized fraud, legal shenanigans. Invalidate only certain states or certain districts. Just right
Richard Aubrey:
Well if the Constitution still exists and Democreats abide by it Biden is impeached and replaced by Kamalla Harris (IIRC on the Viva Frei Roberts Barns video from yesterday). Because in that hypothetical world Democrats have principles. /sarc
Assumptions being that President Trump’s legal challenges fail (bad news all around) and even if Powell is proven correct it will happen too late to preclude Creepy Joe from shambling into the Oval Office. 🙁
Interesting times eh?
TJ,
“if this election is a fraud, then we really are at war with the state and the Evil Ruling Class so welded to throttle it, given the broken social contract this entails.”
This election is by far, the most massive fraud ever perpetrated in America, if not the world. The State, the democrat party and its supporting elements and a ruling class that has fully embraced evil are at war with us. Their goal is absolute control of the many by the few and of that there can no longer be reasonable doubt.
Richard Aubrey:
That’s why I keep raising the question “What’s the remedy?” for any of this. Courts could find it true, but would they order a new election? I doubt it; I don’t think SCOTUS has the guts. But if they did, how would it be conducted? So many states use these machines. How could methods be changed that quickly?
The most I can imagine is that they would order changes for next time. That’s no solution, but at least it would be something. I think that one of the many reasons people shy away from Powell’s claims is that what she is alleging is so huge and so frightening, as well as the difficulty of finding a legal remedy.
DNW,
“it is their untrammeled will and impulses they revere, not some supposed metaphysical order.
If there were a God, they would spit in his face if they caught up with him.”
You give them far too credit. Its not “untrammeled will” they possess but an untrammeled lust for absolute power by the Stalinists and control of other people’s lives by the Trotskys. In the presence of God’s judgement they’d instantly evacuate themselves. They’re only strong when confident of victory.
@Richard Aubrey: “Let’s do a hypo: Everything Powell has said proves to be absolutely and irrefutable true. Well sourced, multiple sources, sworn affidavits, captured messages, screen shots. All of it. What happens?”
Joe Biden is (in Chuck Schumer’s word) installed. In spite of it all.
From Robert Barnes’s twitter feed:
https://twitter.com/Barnes_Law
Trump:
“…fight, and I believe we will prevail! Nevertheless, in the best interest of our Country, I am recommending that Emily and her team do what needs to be done with regard to initial protocols, and have told my team to do the same.”
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1331013908971261953
and…
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1331013907859845121
Mail-in voting mess:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/new-york-congressional-mess-shows-ills-of-mail-in-voting
“…the liberal media was “lying” to the American people about voter fraud.”
https://twitter.com/Barnes_Law/status/1331010119698530304
and…
https://twitter.com/Peoples_Pundit/status/1331014474128617472
Cicero,
“I consider Democrats an unnecessary evil.”
Evil is an existential reality. As long as mankind lacks the ability to always know good from evil. As long as the road to hell is paved with good but mistaken intentions. So too will evil exist.
Which results in to one degree or another, 50% of humanity embracing the evil of man’s inhumanity to man. Absent religious strictures, only facts, logic and reason provide moral guidance in ascertaining the good. And logic and reason rest upon unprovable premises.
On integrity of elections:
“…proof of citizenship is not required when voting in federal elections.”
https://www.theepochtimes.com/stripping-arizona-of-election-safeguards-erodes-voter-integrity-tea-party-official_3590533.html
Well then…
More than 90 million votes were cast in the 4 weeks before Election Day, out of 160 million total. By ignorant, uninformed voters. Of course there was fraud, but as Neo pointed out, proving it after the fact is nigh impossible. It will be replicated in 2022.
So Election Day no longer exists. It is slipping into the grave along with Veterans Day, which now exists mostly as a bank holiday and federal employee paid holiday.
Not interesting times, om, but very sad times, watching the death of the greatest country ever created on the face of the earth. Being oppressed is not interesting, as you shall discover!
One person’s view of Trump’s instructions to the GSA administrator:
https://twitter.com/jskielb3/status/1331034107309125633
H/T Ron Coleman twitter feed
Cicero:
“May you live in interesting times” is a very old Chinese curse. Interesting times being times of famine, war, pestilence, lawlessness, civil unrest, BLM/Antifa running rampant …. You get the drill.
But according to Wickedmedia it may not be Chinese curse after all:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_you_live_in_interesting_times
Faith is a solace, but I am not sanguine about this situation at all.
In the not too distant future, it’ll be Civil War followed by an Article V Convention or a not so gradual slide into a tyrannical enslavement, ala Venezuela. The precipice ahead is acceptance of 1984 previewed by China’s “Social ‘Credit’ Score” or another 1776.
Not even Trump’s reelection can prevent it, the rot’s too deep and far too widespread.
BTW, America’s Social ‘Credit’ Score will effect access to education with a mandatory State approved curriculum, State approval of careers, access to jobs, mandatory vacation ‘seminars’ etc., etc.
Fall below mandatory minimums and mandatory reeducation camps, failure to satisfy minimum requirements at the reeducation camp and reclassification as “irredeemable”. Followed by being sent to the killing fields for the collective good.
Think it can’t happen? Just hyperbole? Among others, Cubans, Venezuelans, Cambodians, Tibetans and N. Koreans will laugh in disbelief if questioned.
There is no depraved monstrousness to which ideological fanatics will not stoop. The end sought always justifies whatever means are necessary for such as them.
Just look for confirmation to where today’s Mass. legislature is considering a bill that will legalize the mass murder of post-birth babies who have survived a botched abortion. Right now, John Adams is rolling over in his grave.
Robert Brown:
No, the UK doesn’t have mail-in voting like so many states have had it this year. It has absentee ballots, which have been around here for ages, too. There are ways to use the mail for voting, and “mail-in ballots” in this country is not the phrase that’s usually employed for absentee ballots. Absentee ballots always are requested, and mail-in ballots is the term ordinarily used when ballots or ballot applications are automatically mailed to every voter on the rolls without being specifically requested by the voter. The only country I have found other than the US that has anything like such a system is Switzerland, and their system actually is quite different also in many ways.
There is far less opportunity for fraud with absentee ballots than the those other kinds of mail-in voting. And in Britain, which uses absentee voting only (not automatic mail-in ballots) there are additional safeguards that absentee ballots in the US do not include:
That’s not all, but you get the picture. Seems quite impressive, doesn’t it? If there’s any jurisdiction in the US with anything like such a multiplicity of safeguards, I’m certainly not aware of it. And yet, even with all of that, we have this:
I have sometimes thought that the GOP would do well to publicize the fact that Europe and the rest of the world have much more stringent protections against fraud than we do.
I think Powell has gotten involved in the election at the insistence of General Flynn. She is putting his already epic battle with Judge Sullivan et al on hold while pursuing a type of case wholly outside her area of expertise. She wouldn’t be doing that without his permission or encouragement, especially since the window for a pardon will be closing if Biden ultimately prevails. Flynn apparently knows where all the intelligence bodies are buried (e.g., servers in Germany), and he trusts and respects Powell. There was no time to find a suitable specialist, but Flynn is willing to risk his freedom for the monumental stakes at hand. At the same time, Powell must take care in protecting “sources and methods,” which prevents her from readily disclosing much of her evidence.
‘ At the same time, Powell must take care in protecting “sources and methods,” which prevents her from readily disclosing much of her evidence. ‘
A very sensible conjecture, LB100, and I certainly hope you’re right about that.
Regarding Tucker Carlson’s interview, could it be that the reason why he was criticized so severely by so many was not so much the nature of the question but the adversarial tone he used, along with the inability to understand (or want to understand) the delicate nature of Powell’s position?
But then Carlson, for all his strengths and abilities may, as a media creature, no longer really be in control of either his tone or the nuances involved—and required—when interviewing certain people in certain situations.
Fraud in PA—testimony from the front lines:
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/11/regarding_postelection_fraud_in_pennsylvania.html
H/T Instapundit.
Multiplied by…how many times? In how many districts? In how many states?
(Of course, that’s the “sheer beauty” of it, isn’t it….? So massive it’s invisible (or as the Democrats would no doubt prefer to claim, “transparent”).
BTW, is there a statue of limitations for a stolen election? (No matter how magnificently—how cleverly—stolen?…) Curious minds, etc….
From the Gosh, Wouldn’t You Know Dept.:
https://www.theepochtimes.com/signature-matching-in-georgia-recount-cant-be-done-says-secretary-of-state_3591068.html
“…to protect voter privacy….”
So refreshing—so reassuring—to know that they’re looking out for the rights of the voter….
And from the No-Fraud Dept.:
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/elections/biden-received-thousands-illegal-votes-non-citizens-not-enough-flip
+ this (for head scratching Guinness Record types):
https://thefederalist.com/2020/11/23/5-more-ways-joe-biden-magically-outperformed-election-norms/
H/T Blazingcatfur blog
Related:
“Stats Prove Ballot Stuffing”:
https://www.newsmax.com/newsmax-tv/morris-ballotstuffing-phoenix-detroit/2020/11/23/id/998441/
(The “So-What” brigades will respond accordingly.)
Pingback:No Kraken – not enough protests. Election fraud only stops if the cheaters lose anyway. – Tom Grey – Families, Freedom, Responsibility
Her charges will die unborn, or postpartum, just like Democrats treat an unwanted child.
Obviously, my theory is open to critique.
No, it won’t, no matter what happens to Trump. Cause God said so. And God wins, unless you have forgotten the power the of Most High.
Brian, if not for Q’s psychological warfare operations, you would have folded up like a lawn chair when they stole the election 2020.
Geoffrey Britain on November 23, 2020 at 9:20 pm said:
None of that is going to happen, because I am here.
People woke up too late, that’s all. Seniority of vibration. Those of us that got ahead of the plan, was given more input.
I wrote all of this late Tuesday night, but after reading the comments I found that most of it was also said by others here at Neo’s Political Emporium of Speculative Delights, although not all points were made at the same time by the same people. Some of it has also probably been superseded by new BREAKING!! news.
However, I hate to have wasted the effort. So here is my mini-opus FWIW.
* * *
“Perhaps she was misled by lying witnesses, perhaps she has gone off the deep end (the Flynn case could do it), or perhaps she has tons of convincing evidence we have yet to see.
But we don’t know.” – Neo
Since Election Day, I have extended my three-day-rule to more like three weeks for a lot of the stories swirling around. The most relevant comment for all of them is “But we don’t know.”
That’s not going to keep me from speculating, however.
I don’t think Sidney Powell is crazy.
I don’t think Trump’s official lawyers are crazy.
(I don’t even think President Trump is crazy.)
However, I do think they are disassociating her from their team for sound reasons.
One is the difference in fraud cases that Neo outlined: different kinds of cases take different legal expertise, and the Trump team has plenty on tap for those without Powell.
One is the complexity of rules about finances & other constraints involving elected officials: they impose certain restrictions on what the lawyers can and can’t do (such as, for example, being forced to abide by certain 35-year-long restraining orders against challenging elections**).
One is party politics.
The statement Powell put out most recently, taken in light of said swirling stories (which most readers here will have seen, so I won’t look for specific links on everything), suggests to me the following scenario.
First, the statements:
https://www.breitbart.com/2020-election/2020/11/23/sidney-powell-agrees-she-is-not-part-trump-legal-team-says-lawsuit-coming-this-week-it-will-be-epic/
So let’s talk party politics.
The key to my scenario came from a nugget in this story***:
https://redstate.com/mike_miller/2020/11/22/sidney-powell-tells-newsmax-tv-election-fraud-cases-we-file-this-week-will-be-biblical-n283517
“Alleged pay-for-play kick backs to public officials, potentially even Georgia GOP Gov. Kemp for a late grant to use Dominion Voting Systems.”
Look again at what Powell said in her long statement:
“My intent has always been to expose all the fraud I could find and let the chips fall where they may —whether it be upon Republicans or Democrats.”
IMO, the GOP demanded that Trump throw Powell out of the official tent, and he had to do it to keep the (little and luke-warm) support of the Party in his election challenges.
Powell may have agreed that she needed to be freed up to do exactly what she asserts.****
FOOTNOTES
*One reference linked here, because it may not be remembered now. As we know from the general election discussion, announcing that something is so doesn’t make so in fact; there are official and formal rules for being part of a legal “team” – as Powell takes care to say.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/rudy-giuliani-sidney-powell-not-part-of-trumps-legal-team
**You might think I am kidding. Ignore the Atlantic’s spin (think: disparate impact) and just go with the bald facts (and remember that the Democrats were not enjoined for allowing the New Black Panthers to physically threaten voters in 2008).
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/01/the-gop-just-received-another-tool-for-suppressing-votes/550052/
***More here, but the details aren’t necessary for this discussion.
These don’t mention it, but Kemp is a long time Republican big-name in Georgia – he was the Secretary of State of Georgia from 2010 to 2018 and a member of the Georgia State Senate from 2003 until 2007 – and Raffensberger is also Republican.
https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/11/whats_kraken.html?utm_source=vuukle&utm_medium=newsfeed
Wood has not been mentioned as part of the Trump Team at any time, but he and Powell are working together.
And for additional pondering, in addition to what others have noted:
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/cortneyobrien/2020/11/20/sidney-powell-larry-oconnor-n2580458
“Sidney Powell Claims That Dominion Is ‘Shredding Documents’ ”
https://notthebee.com/article/the-colorado-secretary-of-state-disappeared-a-dominion-document-and-i-have-questions
****Also just my opinion, but I suspect the main reason Hillary stuck with the Russian claims instead of actually pushing for recounts in the surprise venues where she lost to Trump was because the Democrats knew any serious investigation would reveal their own frauds on her behalf — which were just the humdrum usual procedures, and were too little because they weren’t expected to be needed – the mistake they DIDN’T make this time.
Same thing with Gore’s “never mind”: allowing recounts in ALL of Florida would not be good for the D-Party.
TommyJay on November 23, 2020 at 12:08 pm said:
* * *
Ah, but it does!
Unless you can think of an alternative explanation.
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/elections/dozen-compelling-pieces-evidence-voting-irregularities-2020-election
(sorry that comment was so long – it got away from me!)